Walking FT Questions

Casper · Post by **Casper** » Mon Mar 26, 2007 7:29 pm

So I entered my derby dog in a walking FT not realizing it untill later. The secretary said I cannot ride my horse in gallery to watch.

If you are running in a broke dog stake how do you know how the competition has done so you can tell your self that your dog is not doing as good as what the judges have seen and to pick your dog up?

What else do you do if you are not out watching all the braces? Do you watch with binoculars?

I am only running one dog in both derby stakes (open/ameture) and dont really have any ideas to do with my time. I can only make-up so much BS when talking to strangers :roll: and I am not very good at making conversation.

I am bummed that I cannot bring my pony cause I was hoping to watch the gundog stakes so I have a better idea of what judges are looking for.

Another question is, points earned in a walking trial are the same as earned in a horseback trial right? So if my Derby happens to win they would be the same as derby points in a horse trial. They dont differentiate walking vs. horseback toward the FC?

Scott · Post by **Scott** » Mon Mar 26, 2007 7:44 pm

Wow Casp,

Thats a new one on me. I have road horseback in the gallery on a couple occasions. The judges were always ok with it. Hmmm... Maybe she misunderstood.

I am curious what others have to say about this.

Scott

snips · Post by **snips** » Mon Mar 26, 2007 8:39 pm

I have run in 4 WFT's this spring and there was a riding gallery, and riding scout (thank goodness) allowed in each one.

DGFavor · Post by **DGFavor** » Mon Mar 26, 2007 8:50 pm

If you are running in a broke dog stake how do you know how the competition has done so you can tell your self that your dog is not doing as good as what the judges have seen and to pick your dog up?

Unless your dog has had an obvious breech of manners or has somehow irritated you to the point of exasperation...NEVER PICK UP!! You just handle your dog and try to show it the best you can - let the judges do the judging. If it's done something wrong they'll let you know. Honestly you just never know what they might be liking. I know that what I like is not what most others like. I've won when I thought I shouldn't have and lost when I thought it couldn't be done any better. They certainly can't use your dog if you take it out of contention.

I used to ride every brace so I would know how every dog had done. I've seen too many times now, placements that made no sense to anyone but the judges that I almost prefer not to watch. Just go run my brace, do the best we can then hope it was something they liked.

Leave 'em down - get all the experience you can!!

Casper · Post by **Casper** » Mon Mar 26, 2007 9:30 pm

Apperently this particular trial only allows horses for judges and bird planter. It is California :roll:

So what can I do to kill time other than man the cooler?

DGFavor · Post by **DGFavor** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 12:30 am

Typically folks are pretty darn nice at field trials and love to talk dogs so I don't think you'll have trouble finding someone to chit chat with. I'll see if one of my buddies in CA is going. If so I'll have him look ya' up. Seems weird they don't have a mounted gallery - maybe you can find a nice vantage point to watch from.

Which club/trial is it? When?

larue · Post by **larue** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 5:30 am

the rules with the the horses could be a grounds rule,in other words
they do not want alot of horses on the grounds,so they allow only the
judges,and the planters to use horses.
As far as walking vs horseback points,there is no no difference.
A point is a point,a dog who gets all his points in walking trials has the same title as a dog who did it all in horseback events.

Casper · Post by **Casper** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 8:37 am

It is the GSP club of North Sacramento Valley held at Hastings Island. Like Larue said it is a grounds rule. I guess Hastings Island is a hunting preserve but not real sure

DGFavor · Post by **DGFavor** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:39 pm

Sounds like my buddy is going to the GSP of Or. trial at Madras if it's this weekend.

Have a good time and let us know how it goes. Remember, reporting how your brace went takes a mininimum of twice as long as the brace actually ran. Don't know why, it's just the way it is.

Casper · Post by **Casper** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:16 pm

Is your buddy Frank? I was going to go to that trial till I entered this walking trial not knowing it was a walking trial

DGFavor · Post by **DGFavor** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 12:09 am

Yup, Frank. Nice guy. He came out last summer and spent a week with my buddy Rich training near Boise then came over to my place and put him on some sharpies and sage hens. I think he had a good time. He left me a bottle of some $$$$ Te'killya and I haven't had the guts to touch it. Shoulda put a Coors light label on it.

Buckeye_V · Post by **Buckeye_V** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 6:38 am

As far the point by walking trial......

It sure would be nice to know a FC or DC is a WFC or WDC. I have seen dogs get a FC or DC in walking stakes only that I'm not sure I would be happy hunting over or be proud to own.

You know what I am saying? I also think that a walking point here and there is cool, but in order to finish a FC or DC you should be required to place in a horseback event. Just my opinion.

tenbearsviz · Post by **tenbearsviz** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:34 am

Buckeye_V wrote:As far the point by walking trial......

It sure would be nice to know a FC or DC is a WFC or WDC. I have seen dogs get a FC or DC in walking stakes only that I'm not sure I would be happy hunting over or be proud to own.

snip....

This is a scary statement as to the judging quality in the trials the dogs you mention above earned points in. Sure there are some watered down titles and there always will be but to earn enough points to be called an FC/DC and you wouldn't hunt over them doesn't say too much does it?

The NFC/NAFC and NGDC titles are where you can see the walking vs. horseback.

wannabe · Post by **wannabe** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 3:14 pm

I would be more impressed with a walking trial win in all breed competition than I would a win in a horseback trial closed to one breed only.

Buckeye_V · Post by **Buckeye_V** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 3:51 pm

Not I. But, I would guess it would depend upon the breed. I've seen the level of competition at an all-breed walking trial. The best dogs blew up or went birdless. The first place dogs in the GD stakes were nice, but I have seen nicer at horseback trials.

I guess it depends on your definition of nice.

I would be most impressed with an NAFC or NFC or NGDC.

Post by **ezzy333** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 4:06 pm

I am most impressed with the dogs and don't really care what the handlers are doing. I see many of the same dogs at each and the best dogs in the judges eye wins. Seem thaty is the way it should be.

Ezzy

anne · Post by **anne** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 5:47 pm

I'm going to be at that trial (not running a dog but one of my boy's puppies is also in derby). The rule is due to the location, Hastings won't allow it.
Come find us, we'll be the only Weim people at the trial (there is a concurrent Weim event going on as well).

anne · Post by **anne** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 5:50 pm

Oh, and don't pick your dog up in derby!
I would guess that they will allow a walking gallery.

Buckeye_V · Post by **Buckeye_V** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:42 pm

No, but the same title for both venues is not right.

I sure would like to know if the dog got ALL of it's points in walking trials. I did not liken a cover trial to a walking AKC - AKC - AKC trial. Different animals altogether.

I never said one was better. I said I would like to know... I would like to see... I am only one person.

Casper · Post by **Casper** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:43 pm

I will come looking for you Anne. I need someone to fill a bunch of BS into

Looking foward to it

I dont plan on picking up any dog. I have never attended a walking trial so was unsure of how things opperate. I was actually hoping to be able to see most of the gundog braces from horse back. Oh well guess I will have to wait untill Utah and Idaho

anne · Post by **anne** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 10:04 pm

Oops sorry I just realized you were talking about picking up a dog in gun dog. I thought you were asking about when to pick up a dog in derby and was perplexed. See you this weekend!

tenbearsviz · Post by **tenbearsviz** » Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:50 am

Buckeye_V, I think understand the premise of what you are saying.. Basicly, an FC or DC or AFC (why not) should have been able to had points earned in horseback trials.

I agree that NFC, NAFC & NGDC are titles that display the dogs ability to compete and horseback or walking events. The question comes to why are you looking at the dog and the value of their title. If it is for breeding, I believe that a deeper look regardless is required. Just the points from a horseback stake do not give enough information to determine the competitive quality of the dog.

I feel that for breeding purposes, these titles (FC, DC & AFC) are a starting point but do not detail the quality of the dog. NFC, NAFC & NGDC do a better job. Include 2XCH and RU type AF titles. Top Ten / Dog of the Year type rankings show a dog that may be finished can still compete.

Dont get me wrong, I value the DC, FC & AFC Titles. Horseback or walking isn't the issue to me. It is competitive staying power if you will.

Just my opinion... Others will differ.

(I suppose you and I could go on about all breed vs V only trials too)

Don

Buckeye_V · Post by **Buckeye_V** » Thu Mar 29, 2007 6:55 am

Don:

That is the general gist of it.

The titles should help "filter" dogs. Once I get so far - I want to go see that dog or watch it run (regardless of what kind of trial or test I am at).

Anyhow, I hope to meet you some time at a field trial or the like.

tenbearsviz · Post by **tenbearsviz** » Thu Mar 29, 2007 7:06 am

Buckeye_V, Likewise. We thought about coming up your way in OCT for the MVVC trial. I decided to go to the ODVC trials coming up in May. I need to ration vacation time and the ODVC is doing two trial back to back... Plus I can drive there in 1 day.

Don

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Thu Mar 29, 2007 7:13 am

Buckeye_V wrote:I sure would like to know if the dog got ALL of it's points in walking trials.

That information should be available from the AKC and/or the AF, NGSPA, NVA or similar.

There is so much research that would have to go into breeding anyway, I don't see having different titles helping all that much.

There are a lot of dogs with great titles that get cancer at 5 or 7 years old, are known to throw seizures, etc.

Best regards, Greg J.