THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

NAVHDA, AKC, NSTRA
User avatar
ElhewPointer
Rank: 5X Champion
Posts: 882
Joined: Wed Jun 07, 2006 9:24 pm

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by ElhewPointer » Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:05 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hOb3i8lP ... e=youtu.be

Here's a little video I took of the Champion on one of her finds. As stated before, the judging was how it was supposed to be done. This gives an example of how judges are to watch the dog until collared.

User avatar
PntrRookie
GDF Junkie
Posts: 1870
Joined: Wed Jun 07, 2006 2:41 pm
Location: SE Wisconsin

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by PntrRookie » Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:21 pm

ElhewPointer wrote:...As stated before, the judging was how it was supposed to be done. This gives an example of how judges are to watch the dog until collared.
Nice job Vagas. Knowing Tony, I am sure he and Todd went to great lengths to do this right (along with you and your team). Congrats to Keith and Bobbi, Dennis and all who were invited! You all should be proud!

User avatar
hi-tailyn
Rank: 4X Champion
Posts: 608
Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2008 12:26 pm
Location: Fort Worth, Texas

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by hi-tailyn » Mon Dec 10, 2012 4:05 pm

ElhewPointer wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hOb3i8lP ... e=youtu.be

Here's a little video I took of the Champion on one of her finds. As stated before, the judging was how it was supposed to be done. This gives an example of how judges are to watch the dog until collared.
Video didn't show dog being collared.

Shorthair handlers mostly heel their dogs away from a flush and shot.

Just different than long tails.

Most Shorthair handlers heel their dogs to horse and then have the dog whoa while you get on horse and then release them.

Shows obedience and handle of the dogs.

They must show that they are a Broke Dog. Not a derby dog.

It is Allowed to collar, but not Mandatory.
NASDC 3xNGDC-RU FC AFC Gertrudes Blue Brandi JH (Brandi) http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/3genview.php?id=4915
FC Hi-Tailyn Elektra Fly'n (Elektra)http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=4916
Hi-Tailyn Katara (Katara) http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=4917
Hi-Tailyn Brandi High (Heidi) http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=4920

User avatar
ElhewPointer
Rank: 5X Champion
Posts: 882
Joined: Wed Jun 07, 2006 9:24 pm

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by ElhewPointer » Mon Dec 10, 2012 4:13 pm

hi-tailyn wrote:
ElhewPointer wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hOb3i8lP ... e=youtu.be

Here's a little video I took of the Champion on one of her finds. As stated before, the judging was how it was supposed to be done. This gives an example of how judges are to watch the dog until collared.
Video didn't show dog being collared.

Shorthair handlers mostly heel their dogs away from a flush and shot.

Just different than long tails.

Most Shorthair handlers heel their dogs to horse and then have the dog whoa while you get on horse and then release them.

Shows obedience and handle of the dogs.

They must show that they are a Broke Dog. Not a derby dog.

It is Allowed to collar, but not Mandatory.
You're right. The dog wasn't collared in the video. However many NOVICE judges stop watching the dog after shot. Good ones, as you see in the video watch for everything.

I actually would disagree with the "Shorthair handlers mostly heel their dogs away from a flush and shot." MOST of the dogs I've seen at GSP trials collar their animal.


Thanks for your insight and thoughts.

Middlecreek
Rank: Senior Hunter
Posts: 193
Joined: Mon Mar 09, 2009 7:10 am
Location: Nebraska

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by Middlecreek » Mon Dec 10, 2012 6:48 pm

hi-tailyn wrote:
ElhewPointer wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hOb3i8lP ... e=youtu.be

Here's a little video I took of the Champion on one of her finds. As stated before, the judging was how it was supposed to be done. This gives an example of how judges are to watch the dog until collared.
Video didn't show dog being collared.

Shorthair handlers mostly heel their dogs away from a flush and shot.

Just different than long tails.

Most Shorthair handlers heel their dogs to horse and then have the dog whoa while you get on horse and then release them.

Shows obedience and handle of the dogs.

They must show that they are a Broke Dog. Not a derby dog.

It is Allowed to collar, but not Mandatory.
If I remember that find right, she was collared after the shot just like all her other finds. I too have very rarely seen a handler heel their dog after a find no matter what breed it was. When they do it, they give a verbal "command" to allow the dog to move. As long as the dogs are given a command that allows them to move everything is in order. It gets a little foggy though, when a handler shoots and then immediately turns around towards the dog without saying anything and the dog comes to them. It just raises the question of how steady after the shot the dog really is? Not saying it is right or wrong, but you can only judge what you see and judges don't get the advantage of seeing how the dogs are trained.

Hope to see you there next year, you missed a great trial!
FC/RU CH SM Queen High Flush (Abby) http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/genview.php?id=3815
2xCH/2xruCH FC BDK's Sin City Wildcard (Deuce) http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/genview.php?id=2269

Brooks Carmichael
Rank: Master Hunter
Posts: 283
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 11:36 am
Location: Nebraska

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by Brooks Carmichael » Mon Dec 10, 2012 7:30 pm

Years ago you could not collar your dog in the GSP World over time that changed and it was allowed. This was only in AKC trials. You have the option of collaring your dog or calling him to you after the shot and healing him away. It is handlers choice. I have seen some pros collar dogs and some heal their dogs away and same goes for amateur. If I remember correctly John Rabidou has healed his dogs away most of the time. I may be incorrect in John doing this but that is how I remembered it.



I

bb560m
Rank: 2X Champion
Posts: 406
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 2:12 pm

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by bb560m » Mon Dec 10, 2012 7:50 pm

I prefer to heel them away, that way there is no confusion with a tap on the head or the motion of such when reaching down to collar.

User avatar
jcbuttry8
Rank: 5X Champion
Posts: 801
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 10:21 pm
Location: Bucks County, PA

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by jcbuttry8 » Mon Dec 10, 2012 8:06 pm

Congrats to all involved. What an honor just to have been invited to run. Sounds like this trial was ran right and all had a great time.

Joe

User avatar
hi-tailyn
Rank: 4X Champion
Posts: 608
Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2008 12:26 pm
Location: Fort Worth, Texas

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by hi-tailyn » Mon Dec 10, 2012 8:15 pm

I guess I'm old school.

Yes John R. always heels his dogs away.

I know I need to get working for next year. Something new to try and accomplish. A invite to the 2013 invitational.
NASDC 3xNGDC-RU FC AFC Gertrudes Blue Brandi JH (Brandi) http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/3genview.php?id=4915
FC Hi-Tailyn Elektra Fly'n (Elektra)http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=4916
Hi-Tailyn Katara (Katara) http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=4917
Hi-Tailyn Brandi High (Heidi) http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=4920

User avatar
ElhewPointer
Rank: 5X Champion
Posts: 882
Joined: Wed Jun 07, 2006 9:24 pm

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by ElhewPointer » Tue Dec 11, 2012 8:52 am

hi-tailyn wrote:I guess I'm old school.

Yes John R. always heels his dogs away.

I know I need to get working for next year. Something new to try and accomplish. A invite to the 2013 invitational.
Just want to clear some things up for the people that actually were not at the trial.

If the dog was "heeled" every time, it wouldn't have been an issue. The judge handled this in the ABSOLUTE best way. The dog was getting something done after day one. After day one the judge went to the handler and told him that the dog did a nice job and then asked the handler to see the dogs stand all the way through until collared on day 2. The judged wanted to see if the dog was doing it on its own. That is the perfect way to handle this situation. On day 2 the dog did the same as day one.

Lets not forget here. The dog was on standby for the finals. The judges obviously thought highly of the dog.

I just thought I would share what actaully happend since I was there instead of someone who didn't attend the trial.

Thanks again to all involved, it was a great event and im looking forward to getting the ball rolling on next years.

User avatar
hi-tailyn
Rank: 4X Champion
Posts: 608
Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2008 12:26 pm
Location: Fort Worth, Texas

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by hi-tailyn » Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:54 am

I never intended to ruffle any-ones feathers.

I think this the next best thing to the Nationals.

I think what Hayley has done to back and put on this event along with Vagas is to be commended.

Like I stated earlier, This gives us something else next to the Nationals to try and win.

Some of us don't have those big of pockets to hit every trial at a whim. But we all want what is best for our breed.

Have heard nothing but good comments on the grounds, top notch judges and quality of birds.

Hope this is a great jump start to next year.

Congrats to the Keith and Bobbi, and Dennis on a well deserved win and definitely something to brag about.

1st winner of a GSP Invitational.
NASDC 3xNGDC-RU FC AFC Gertrudes Blue Brandi JH (Brandi) http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/3genview.php?id=4915
FC Hi-Tailyn Elektra Fly'n (Elektra)http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=4916
Hi-Tailyn Katara (Katara) http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=4917
Hi-Tailyn Brandi High (Heidi) http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=4920

User avatar
Hunter
Rank: Master Hunter
Posts: 273
Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 9:59 am
Location: Masonville, Iowa

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by Hunter » Tue Dec 11, 2012 11:31 am

Congrats to the winner, their will be other Invitational winners in the future but none can claim the first. As for the video and the judging, that should be and for the most part is the norm for all judges who have been around awhile. The handler was having trouble locating or flushing the bird the way it looked and the judge got off the horse to get a closer look but keeping his eyes on the dog. When you judge that is what you are supposed to do, watch the dog and not worry about the handler, as you are judging the dog. To many judges are picked today because they are close or club members of the club putting on a trial and allot of times you see the same dogs put up all the time, some deserving and some not. I read an article from years ago and it was about Bob Merkel and talking about judging, and he said something to the effect of trials should be divided into regions and if you were to put on a trial you should have to get judges from different regions to judge, that way they are not familiar with the dogs or handlers and I thought that was a great point and that was years ago. For this invitational you had two pointer judges and that accomplished the same idea, not familiar with the dogs or handlers. When you judge you are only going to make one person happy for the most part, the winner, but if you ride hard for every dog and not just a couple that you may like thruought the stake, you still probably wont make anymore people happy but you will gain the respect of all, that you paid close attn and were fair to all dogs and handlers, and that should be the norm. Congrats to all on the 2012 season and good luck to all coming 2013.
Jerry Alden

2X NGDC/GFC/FC Clk's Point Me The Way ( Allie ) http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/genview.php?id=2765

User avatar
DGFavor
GDF Junkie
Posts: 1949
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2006 1:55 am
Location: Pocatello, ID

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by DGFavor » Wed Dec 12, 2012 11:49 am

Congrats to Dennis, Keith and Bobbi as well as big kudos to the folks that went to the effort to put it all together and pull it off! Glad it went well! :mrgreen:

Blue Dawn Kennel
Rank: 5X Champion
Posts: 830
Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2007 1:44 pm
Location: Madison, KS

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by Blue Dawn Kennel » Wed Dec 12, 2012 6:33 pm

Loved the video Vagas, wish there had been more and pics. The ground in that video looked really nice. I really like it when a judge get's off his horse to look in hard area's where the handler is having problems finding birds. When judging I always do that and it's also curtious to the handlers and shows your really watching and looking.

Congrats to David & Hayley and you Vagas and all else who helped support and put on this event and taking the time out to put it together and be there through the whole deal.
BDK'S Kessie's Sin City Casino~http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/genview.php?id=1270
BDK's All That Jazz~ http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/genview.php?id=5853
BDK's Try Your Luck~ http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/genview.php?id=5854
"Home of 60 NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP TITLES (wins & runner ups) & Many Many Field Champions"

Jager
Rank: Master Hunter
Posts: 214
Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2007 1:50 pm
Location: Eastern WV/VA border

Re: THE NGSPA INVITATIONAL 2012

Post by Jager » Wed Dec 19, 2012 10:14 pm

Here are a few pictures from the Invitational. Of course most of them are personal to us & our dog (Duke); however you will also get a good idea of the grounds in these photos as well. Enjoy... http://youtu.be/ZFVq8dGw_mk

- Cindy
Dear Lord, Please make me the kind of person my dogs think I am.

http://www.allnkennels.com

Post Reply