Walking Field Trials - Where to get info?

[Ayres]

Current plans for my V: AKC Hunt Tests all the way up to MH, Conformation Championship.

Justus' sire was a DC so I'm also mildly thinking of getting into field trials. The only problem is, I don't want my dog running 500 yards ahead of me in a field trial and then expect him to range close when I'm out hunting wild birds with no horses.

I've heard of walking field trials, and by the name alone it sounds more up my alley. Anyone know where I can get good information on walking field trials, rules, goals, what to do and how to succeed? I'm still evaluating whether or not I want to get into more competitions with my dog (I really just enjoy hunting over him myself) but I like to have a lot of info before deciding anything.

Also, quick tag-along question, what's the difference between a FC and an AFC? I've known this at one point in time but it didn't stick and I don't know where to go to get information any quicker than here. (Even Google is overrun with more advertisements than anything.)

Thanks all -

[Greg Jennings]

Check out the information here:
http://www.akc.org/events/field_trials/ ... /index.cfm

A walking trial is one where the handlers are obliged to walk. If it doesn't say "Walking", the handlers may be mounted. Even in a horseback trial, you may walk, it just isn't going to make you popular.

Here is the AKC event search page: http://www.akc.org/events/search/ .

Use it to find a trial near you and go watch. Better yet, call your V club and offer to help.

A quick look shows there are a lot of field trials in your area.

You might also order Clif's book on the subject here:
http://www.vizslabook.com/

Best regards,

[ezzy333]

Steve,

They have them at DesPlaines. The GSH people had one going when we hunt tested there this spring. Tests were on one side of the road and trials on the other.


Ezzy

[Ayres]

Steve,

They have them at DesPlaines. The GSH people had one going when we hunt tested there this spring. Tests were on one side of the road and trials on the other.


Ezzy

I thought both sides were running hunt tests! I'll have to pay more attention next time.

And, yeah, I always forget about the AKC search and head straight for Google. When it comes to dog things, all Google ever throws up is advertisements to buy or sell dogs or dog supplies. (And the occasional dog club hosting a hunt test or field trial.)

[ezzy333]

Steve,

I think I mispoke or at least led you astray. They did have them there but not the weekend you were there. They were running tests bothsides that day.

Al

[Ayres]

Ah, gotcha.

Anyone know where I can find information on walking trials on the net while I wait for the AKC to send me the pamphlet?

I ordered that pamphlet sometime last year before they started charging for them, and was sent the pamphlet for retrievers and not the pointing breed one. Since it was free at the time, I couldn't complain.

[Greg Jennings]

Surf around in the first AKC link that I posted previously. It's all there, you just have to find it.

Best,

[larue]

first off,horseback or walking trials are judged by the same standards.As far as what it takes to win a trial,consistant foward movement
a broke dog,and good style will win often,or at least get you a ribbon in adult stakes
in puppy/derby power or potential is looked at.
The only real way to learn about field trials are to go watch and run some,just realize that long time trialers get upset at some trials,as it is a competition so if you have a bad experience in your first attempt,try again.

[snips]

I am trying to figure out how a dog can consistantly run foreward when I am walking and not loose them. ??? If my dog is running foreward all the time I better be on a 4-wheeler or horse, because he`ll be gone.

[ezzy333]

You might think that long time trialers would be old enough to control their emotions and not cause everyone to be uncomfortable around them.

Ezzy

[snips]

I am not sure what that means, but I really don`t know. It would seem to me that a dog would have to maintain a range that he knows your whereabouts. (and you know his). In NSTRA if my dog runs to the far end of the field and points it would be very hard to know their where abouts many times if the judge was not watching them.

[Dave Quindt]

Snips wrote:

I am trying to figure out how a dog can consistantly run foreward when I am walking and not loose them. ??? If my dog is running foreward all the time I better be on a 4-wheeler or horse, because he`ll be gone.

Brenda,

When you hunt, do you allow your dogs to backcast? Do you allow your dogs to run anywhere they want, including back behind you?

When you are running NSTRA, and you are heading to the NW corner of a field, where you know neither dog has hunted before (and you really need a bird) do you expect the dog to go with you in that direction, or do you allow the dog to swing behind you and head for the SE corner of the field?

What Dennis is describing is the same thing. In broke dog trials, the dog is expected to hunt in the direction the handler (and the course) is moving. If the handler is moving north, the dog better moving in a roughly northerly direction. Its allowed to swing to either side in order to hunt objectives, but once it hunts an area, the expectation is that the dog will continue in the direction that the handler has set.

Dogs that back cast are dogs that get separated from the handler, and end up lost.

FWIW,
Dave

[larue]

snips,as dave stated a dog should be ahead of you,also a dog should not yo-yo or hunt foward 100 yards,and then come all the way back to you .I know of several fc's who rarely get over 150 yards ahead of the handler.They hunt with there handler staying foward and on an edge and do not make a mistake.
A nice run In a field trial is a consistant dance,the dog is running ahead of you,turning when you do,yet staying ahead
of you and hunting all the right places.Weekend field trials are more about consistancy and manners than about power and independance.
The biggist difference in walking stakes and horseback stakes will be the grounds,and the grounds dictate how big a dog should run.
so in effect most walking trials the dogs will run closer than horseback events.Yet I have watched and won at eagle with runs that you consistanly loose the dog for 4 or 5 minutes,only to find the dog on point forward.Walking trials can be very competitive!


ezzy333 ,in any competitive sport people get upset,yes adults.
I watch the milwaukee brewers on tv all the time,and I remember there manager getting thrown out twice in recent games.
People will get upset when they think they got a bad call.
No one stops going to baseball games when the manager gets thrown out,or a fan gets mad. I was just trying to let Ayres
know that sometimes trials can have upset people.

[snips]

Thanks guys, that was what I wanted to know.

[ckfowler]

I hunt often in small areas. With everyone wanting a part of the country life, 100 acres is still a fair sized farm around here. Most of that will be in crops, cow pasture, or woods that haven't been cut down yet I want my dog to be biddable and go in the direction I ask her to but if she casts behind me because she scented something faint that we missed first time, I'm tickled. The NSTRA 30-40 acre field is not very different from the patches of cover I frequent, 60 acres is a large piece of fallow ground with today's clean farming. UFTA trials are on 10 acre fields so handling is even more important, especially since the boundary may be just a mowed strip! Pheasants here also seem to learn a knack for letting you pass or circling so coming back through some covers is often as productive as the first pass through. I love fresh cover but kill many birds in trial or hunting that another good dog missed.

I also hunt for the one grouse that lives in SE Ohio. For me that means covering alot of ground on some relatively steep hills. I want my dog to cast the direction I indicate so I can follow a ridgeline instead of always going up and down. We cover way more ground because the State Forests are larger tracts of land and cover so she can't be underfoot. She also doesn't need to be over the hill all the time as that one grouse won't wait for me forever

I have a great deal of respect for people running dogs with lion's hearts, giving 110% to find birds and accepting training STW&S. My dog has lines from AA and coverdog trial Champions and though she probably runs bigger than I need, on good days loves her daddy and we work together. I've never hunted from horseback and my dog is my hunting companion first, not looking to improve the breed, so that venue has less interest for my participation. Definitely not bashing, just some humble observations on application for me personally

[Ayres]

ezzy333 ,in any competitive sport people get upset,yes adults. I watch the milwaukee brewers on tv all the time,and I remember there manager getting thrown out twice in recent games. People will get upset when they think they got a bad call. No one stops going to baseball games when the manager gets thrown out,or a fan gets mad. I was just trying to let Ayres
know that sometimes trials can have upset people.

While that's true, it still isn't an excuse for bad sportsmanship. As hunters, we're already under the magnifying glass, so I would hope that even when a guy thinks he got a bad call at a field trial he could be smart enough to not make a big scene about it.

not looking to improve the breed

Don't sell yourself short. I think you're doing a fine job instilling a good quality in your dog (ranging to meet your needs, not more). I know people that won't run in field trials and strictly do hunt tests because they're a better indicator of how a dog will perform on a wild bird hunt. Most people, when hunting, don't need their dog to be ranging out 500 yards... maybe unless they're on horseback, but I don't know anyone in my area that actually hunts on horseback.

[ckfowler]

Thought about breeding Scout initially as she has great lines but at age 5, decided it wasn't worth the hassle. I could get another dog with Diablo Ace and Grouse Ridge from Long Gone Setters for sure and there is a guy here in Ohio breeding some dogs from there too. Next one should be a Gordon and I can't wait to do NSTRA and UFTA with that one to raise some eyebrows I'm told by a friend who does the hunt tests that Scout would get JH easily and may end up putting in the runs for that. SH and MH are too much training for me.

Any day in the field or woods is a good one!

[LookoutDog]

You also may want to explore National Bird Hunters Association(NBHA) and U.S. Complete Shooting Dog Association field trials. These are walking stakes. Also, many field trial clubs will hold walking stakes in addition to their all-age, shooting dog, and derby stakes.

Many of these field trials will be listed in the American Field.

You can download the NBHA rules from their website -- www.nbhafuturity.com.

[gunner]

Here's the new website of the Amateur Field Trial Clubs of America (American Field) and it's numerous amateur clubs across the country.
The site also lists the running rules, bylaws, guidelines for field trials, breed championships, dog win data base, purchasable art prints and much more.
Many of the clubs hold walking stakes, many in conjunction with US Complete, National Bird Hunter, American Bird Hunter, and breed specific clubs ie GSP, Brittney, Visla, Weim.

www.aftca.org