I'm A Dunce

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:32 am

So, I'm a dunce.

I'm training my V to MH and he's been breaking when he sees the bird shot.

All this time, I thought it was the report of the shotgun meaning something different than the report of the blank pistol.

Then, Sunday while training, the fellow that I was training with ripped off three shots at a bird and missed all three. My boy "let down", but he didn't budge.

So, it's finally soaked through my thick skull that it's seeing the bird hit and fall that is triggering him to break to go for the retrieve.

Lesson learned: paint the picture for the dog a layer at a time.

Another front:

I was letting my GSP pup get some points in on "left over" birds in a fence row. It's a good place because the birds run to the other side and pretty much means ends any chances for him to catch them.

There was another guy there with an old dog. The dog was puttering around here and there. But *all three* times my pup pointed, this dog came charging in and stole the point. Again, it finally soaked through my skull that the old dog was watching for my dog to point so that he could steal it. I picked my dog up and went home.

Lesson learned: my dog's future is too important to risk taking chances. Control the situation to rule risks completely out.

Best regards,

QCBirddogs · Post by **QCBirddogs** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 8:50 am

Greg,

Often many people try to over think training. You are definetly not the first and wont be the last! Keeping it simple is the key.

Try putting a few birds on a kite, string to a horse shoe or string on a piece of garden hose. This way you can use the same three or four birds over and over. It also keeps the birds from flying far off and the dog could see them hit the ground. He sounds like he knows the rules just anticapating the command a bit!

Also, I try not to let a dog retrive birds that were just shot. I usually walk out and get them and give one or two a toss, then let them get one. It reduces the jitters in the dog in my opinion. Then when you finally say the "F" word to him at trails or test he takes off like a bat! MAkes them more excited that you actually said it and letting him do it!

Remember in the MH test, a dog has to back through anothers retrive and you are not allowed to restrain him. The other handler usually says the "F" word a little louder than normall too. A good time to think about how you release him for the retrive too. HE needs to know not to go till you touch him or give another command.

I didnt know if you were aware of any of this, if so I appologize, maybe it will help a few others though.

Phil
REO

Post by **grant** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 9:40 am

Thats good info, thanks Phil! You answered a few questions I had...

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 2:56 pm

Hi Phil,

Thanks for the information. Yep. I'm fully up on the requirements for JH, SH and MH.

I'm actually testing for SH, but I train, at least largely, to MH requirements. SH is a step along the way to me.

My answer to "OK", "All right", "Fetch", etc. has been to only release my dog for any reason with a tap on the head. When he's been steady for a while, I'll overlay a verbal command.

What I've been doing is doing the starter pistol on a lot of birds, shooting some and bringing them to him to play with and letting him retrieve a few.

I think you're spot on with respect to what's going on in his head. He's 2.5 years old...pretty young for a V.

I've never carded birds. Too many trees where I train. I read about the horseshoe thing the other day in a post by Jim West. I'm going to give it a try. I thought about inserting a length of something flexible to avoid tearing the legs off my (very limited supply of) homers.

Gosh, I'm having fun with the hunt test stuff!

Best regards,

snips · Post by **snips** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 9:21 pm

Thats what we did when getting Baron ready for MH. I became the retriever. Solves him breaking when the bird dropped.

QCBirddogs · Post by **QCBirddogs** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 12:09 am

Greg,

Pretty ironic you mention Jim West ( I assume you mean the GSP trainer)..........The trainer he basiclly got his start with is sitting right here with me!

He is here from Iowa, training with us for a month or so........running from the cold and the snow!

THe kited birds always find a tree to land in dont they! I have scaled a few! I do like the horseshoe method when breaking dogs though, have to give ole Jerry credit for that one!

Also when training a dog to be broke to fall......I would not use the blank gun all the time.....work in the shotgun and dont let him retrieve. You will be surprised how dogs get to think that the big blast means fetch and the little blast means no bird!

Phil
REO

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 9:19 pm

Hi Phil,

It's a small world!

I've decided on a couple of things:

1. I'm going to swap over to shooting the shotgun most of the time. We'll be running SH events and he won't be hearing the blank pistol that much. It'll be the shotgun.

2. I'm going to cut down the number of times that I let him retrieve. I've been doing it 1 out of 3 or 4. He's a fantastic natural retriever and he's getting practice retrieving out of the back right now, anyway. His back lacks intensity.

Best regards,

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 9:56 pm

I forgot to mention another of the things I've been doing to help my V-boy stay steady...

I take some extra birds in a bird bag.

When he points, I kick around away from the bird on the ground and thow one, or more, of the birds out of the bag. Only then do I kick up the bird on the ground.

Sometimes it's one bird from the bag, sometimes two or even three.

I sometimes shoot the last bird for him.

Best regards,