Springer Introduction to pigeon

[Takem]

Introduced my English springer spaniel to a dead pigeon. He grabbed it and ran right to me. Made sure he would come my way. He held that bird tight for at least 5 minutes. My training book says to let him hold it a while and praise. How long should I let him hold it until I pry it loose?

[mnaj_springer]

Until he gets bored of holding it. Or begins trying to chew it. IMO.

[Takem]

Thanks. Did it again today. He really loves pigeon.

[gundogguy]

Bumper vid https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K0CRzD9-mC4

Cold dead pigeon https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9W4X7ob-4z8

[NEhomer]

Great, now get him some live birds. If he's a young pup, start out with it in a cage so it doesn't scratch him or frighten him.

I have a vid from when I did this with my young setter. He went ballistic and I knew I had a bird dog!

[Takem]

Great, now get him some live birds. If he's a young pup, start out with it in a cage so it doesn't scratch him or frighten him.

I have a vid from when I did this with my young setter. He went ballistic and I knew I had a bird dog!

I did. He circled the cage with his tail going. I took one out to let him sniff it and he grabbed it. He's very birdy for 12 weeks old.

[IsThisHeaven?]

Sounds like a real nice pup you have there. Where did you get him? Photos?

[polmaise]

A different approach taken here.
Whilst introducing a pup to feather or fur in the early stages (we do it around 6 -9 weeks old) is encouraged but it is not continued.
The video posted by Gundogguy' shows a 'placeboard' method to shape a behaviour of re-call to a known safe place with a hold at a level less threatening or imposing on the dog to give rather than 'have taken from' . (we use the back of the truck ,but that's just because we don't build benches) .

The process using bumpers/dummies allows us to repeat this behaviour rather than a constant supply of game ,which can become 'mouthy' after a few deliveries.
Once the 'shaped behaviour' is established and the 'fun' of bringing it back and 'giving so the dog can do it again' is established ,it doesn't matter what is in it's mouth it will hold and hold on to until it is commanded to release willingly.

If something has to be prised from a dog then a Tug of war has developed. The current owner is calling the shots

[gundogguy]

A different approach taken here.
Whilst introducing a pup to feather or fur in the early stages (we do it around 6 -9 weeks old) is encouraged but it is not continued.
The video posted by Gundogguy' shows a 'placeboard' method to shape a behaviour of re-call to a known safe place with a hold at a level less threatening or imposing on the dog to give rather than 'have taken from' . (we use the back of the truck ,but that's just because we don't build benches) .

The process using bumpers/dummies allows us to repeat this behaviour rather than a constant supply of game ,which can become 'mouthy' after a few deliveries.
Once the 'shaped behaviour' is established and the 'fun' of bringing it back and 'giving so the dog can do it again' is established ,it doesn't matter what is in it's mouth it will hold and hold on to until it is commanded to release willingly.

If something has to be prised from a dog then a Tug of war has developed. The current owner is calling the shots

Excellent Robert, Though the bench fulfills many other uses for me. The "safe place" concept can be established with just about any thing that distinguishes it self from the sorrounding area that one is working in. A door mat, small piece of carpet, piece of ply wood. I build benches and use them for lots of things. When we travel to train I use a door mat, if it is called for.
How ever your comments concerning the pupsters development are right on

[Takem]

Sounds like a real nice pup you have there. Where did you get him? Photos?

Got him from Jim Karlovec at flushing star gun dogs in Ohio.

[welsh]

Cute pup!

I'm curious, because you referred to a book, what book are you working from?

My take (which is by no means dogma) is that 12 weeks is too early for birds, live or dead. Simple reason being this is an age when they still like to chew everything they get their mouths on, which leads to me needing to take the bird away, which leads to a disagreement over who owns the bird, which leads to a sulky puppy who doesn't want to bring any more birds to the big mean jerk who takes them away. Dummies only for now until I've shaped the return I want. Lots of other things to accomplish in the meantime. But I am sure there are as many approaches to this as there are trainers.

My own new Springer pup turned 12 weeks today. Incidentally, I do use a placeboard and find it's a fantastic training aid.

[Takem]

Read a few but the one I'm following is "Hup! training flushing spaniels the American way". It's very easy to follow and answers most of my questions. If you have another recommendation I'd love to hear it. I trained my lab using Evan Graham's smart works book and videos.

[polmaise]

Read a few but the one I'm following is "Hup! training flushing spaniels the American way". It's very easy to follow and answers most of my questions. If you have another recommendation I'd love to hear it. I trained my lab using Evan Graham's smart works book and videos.

Looks like you have everything covered !
Should be a breeze from now on in.

[Takem]

Read a few but the one I'm following is "Hup! training flushing spaniels the American way". It's very easy to follow and answers most of my questions. If you have another recommendation I'd love to hear it. I trained my lab using Evan Graham's smart works book and videos.

Looks like you have everything covered !
Should be a breeze from now on in.

Not sure if you're being sincere or sarcastic

[welsh]

That book is the best I've found in terms of laying out a program to follow.

[mnaj_springer]

"Hup" is a good training book with a nice program. I've used the FF method described in that book and have liked the process and the result.

[gundogguy]

Read a few but the one I'm following is "Hup! training flushing spaniels the American way". It's very easy to follow and answers most of my questions. If you have another recommendation I'd love to hear it. I trained my lab using Evan Graham's smart works book and videos.

Evan's SmartWorks is and excellent choice for the non-slip retriever. James Spencer's Hup Training flushing spaniels the American way Is a fine choice. Stick with Smart works for your Retriever and Hup" for the Springer. The methods in each are radically different, different type dogs different stokes. Out side of that your, breeder, if he is creditable will be your best adviser on your Springers development.
Hal

[CDN_Cocker]

Sounds like a real nice pup you have there. Where did you get him? Photos?

Got him from Jim Karlovec at flushing star gun dogs in Ohio.

If you got him from Jim you'll have no problem getting him to hunt. My cocker is from Jim and he is all hunt all the time and a great retriever. Have fun.

[gundogguy]

Jim Karlovic would be the best council you have. He would be your go to spaniel guy, with questions or issues. Jim and I spent time together 20 yrs or so ago in Wales when we were both at Saighton Kennels on dog buying and training week!
L to R Photo of myself, my wife Nancy, Jim Karlovic, Lee Roy VanKirk and Andrew Greene

[polmaise]

Facial hair and 'Beanie hats' were all the rage back then

[welsh]

Wait ... were all the rage?

I thought all you folks across the pond looked like Graham West?