Gun Dog Forum

Hi All,
I am a total beginner at training. We got a Lab-Pointer mix. Father is a supposed AKC champion pointer mother is pure bred. We got him really inexpensive because mother has no papers. The main reason was for a pet to replace our old lab that our other dog misses terribly. My hopes is that there might be a bird dog in this puppy. Neither parents or grand parents hunt. The puppy(Samson) doesn't fetch instinctively like our other lab. I took him for his first walk alone in the canyon to see if there is any bird drive and he wouldn't go more than 5 feet from me to sniff around. We actually came up on some birds on the ground and he could care less. I don't know if it is because we have only had him 5 days and he's 10 weeks old or he just doesn't have the drive. When I picked him he was the one in the litter that kept finding a bone I put in the grass and seemed to want to sniff around. He would go up and down the fence line sniffing. With that my question is "what can I do to try to pull out any prey drive in Samson?" I have ordered some wings and DVDs from GDS they should be here Friday. Also I got a duck and pheasant toy. Should I let him play with them or would that mess things up later on real birds.
Thanks
Mike

Give the puppy time. It is a baby wondering around in a brand new world . Take the pup for walks, keep your mouth shut, and in about 5 or 6 months tell us how the pup is acting and maybe we can help you. As of now teach the manners you want, housebreak, and socialize. Prey drive or desire as I like to call it kicks in sometime in the first year normally. And it has nothing to do with retrieving.

Ezzy

Expose him to birds. Wings, not so useful. Live pigeons if you don't have wild birds. Puppies can have their prey instinct "turned on" by lots of exposure to live birds. You can't make them have a prey drive though, unless the genes are there for it. Here is a pic of first bird intro for a 9 week old lab puppy. She does lots of off lead field exposure in different terrain with grass of different heights - happy timing I think the old timers call it. She is now nuts over birds.

Mike,

EvanG

A direct answer is "no", it cannot be taught. It can be cultivated, and if a dog has any measure of it that means it can be developed to a higher state. But, if a dog has no prey drive you've got what you've got.

Fortunately, most dogs have some degree of drive in them, even if it requires some cultivating. If you were looking for a hunting retriever you surely took the long-odds route to it. But that doesn't mean you're out of luck. I very likely means he won't be great at it in the long run.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEiZFkUSO58

EvanG

I hope to build a coup this weekend for some pigeons. I hope he turns out but a PudelPointer is my future. I had one on hold and I had to let my spot go due to an unforeseen bill. Then we had to put our Lab down. Samson was purchased as a pet and companion/family member for us and our other dog. But, I have hopes because of his breed. I look at it as a trial run for my future PP. I would hate to fail as a trainer on a $1400 pup. If it works out Samson can hunt it is a huge bonus. So I will not worry so much and let him be a pup. When I introduce him to pigeons do I just put the wing restraint on and put the pup out and watch. Do I try to entice him if he wont leave my side?
Thanks
Mike

MikeE15 wrote:Hi All,
I am a total beginner at training. We got a Lab-Pointer mix. Father is a supposed AKC champion pointer mother is pure bred. We got him really inexpensive because mother has no papers. The main reason was for a pet to replace our old lab that our other dog misses terribly. My hopes is that there might be a bird dog in this puppy. Neither parents or grand parents hunt. The puppy(Samson) doesn't fetch instinctively like our other lab. I took him for his first walk alone in the canyon to see if there is any bird drive and he wouldn't go more than 5 feet from me to sniff around. We actually came up on some birds on the ground and he could care less. I don't know if it is because we have only had him 5 days and he's 10 weeks old or he just doesn't have the drive. When I picked him he was the one in the litter that kept finding a bone I put in the grass and seemed to want to sniff around. He would go up and down the fence line sniffing. With that my question is "what can I do to try to pull out any prey drive in Samson?" I have ordered some wings and DVDs from GDS they should be here Friday. Also I got a duck and pheasant toy. Should I let him play with them or would that mess things up later on real birds.
Thanks
Mike

IS the Father a CH or an FC on the AKC papers.... FC is a Field Champion CH is Show champion this is a problem many people have when looking at AKC papers thinking CH means anything dealing with the field which many dogs that have a bunch of CH in front of the name can have little to no hunting instincts bred as a primary ingredients in a dogs pedigree only conformation which many times steers away from what can get out in the field and hunt well

What you want to see with an AKC pedigree is FC DC AFC NAFC NFC VC before the name or Jh i ok but SH or MH is better

and in unpapered animal...and cheap puppy do not mean to be cruel but sometimes you might get lucky IF one or better both of the dogs were a hunting dogs but if it is just dogs are bred because it was a certain breed with no regards of what it will really will bring to the table then you have a companion dog.

Can prey drive be taught?

No. But it can be awakened if it's in there.

MikeE15 wrote:I hope to build a coup this weekend for some pigeons. When I introduce him to pigeons do I just put the wing restraint on and put the pup out and watch. Do I try to entice him if he wont leave my side?
Thanks
Mike

Evan Graham has a link posted to a utube video he made showing how to get the pup interested in birds. It is in one of his answers in this post. It will give you an idea on what to do

As the others have said, the answer to your question is "no". But he is just a baby and it is too early to tell too much at this point. It seems that most newbies are way to anxious and impatient. You have to let them go through the puppy stage without too much expectations too soon. With some puppies it the prey drive is obvious pretty early, while with others, it takes a little longer. Just don't expect too much too soon. That can be a big mistake IMO.

Charlie

EvanG wrote:Mike,

EvanG

A direct answer is "no", it cannot be taught. It can be cultivated, and if a dog has any measure of it that means it can be developed to a higher state. But, if a dog has no prey drive you've got what you've got.

Fortunately, most dogs have some degree of drive in them, even if it requires some cultivating. If you were looking for a hunting retriever you surely took the long-odds route to it. But that doesn't mean you're out of luck. I very likely means he won't be great at it in the long run.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEiZFkUSO58

EvanG

+1!

Not sure it can be taught, if it isnt there. But it can be awakened if it is there.

My guess is it is there in any good bird dog. It just needs to be awakened in one not exposed.