A mock hunt question

GSP4ME · Post by **GSP4ME** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 11:54 am

So I took my 10 month old mutt on his first dove hunt. The doves weren't flying so good but driving the roads I was bumping quail left and right. So I abandoned the dove hunt and heres what we did instead. I had brought along a couple of trapped feral pigeons in case there was no bird action, I could get some training in. Once I saw how plentiful the quail were, I couldn't resist letting him get into his first covey. Took him a time or two to realize he was causing them to scatter but on his first solid point, he allowed me to flush the birds. At that point, I released a pigeon and then shot the pigeon for him. His retrieve was a little sloppy but he delivered the bird to hand and I thought that was about as good a mock hunt as I could hope to produce. Quail season is still a bit off, but is there any reason not to use this training method - pigeon swap once he locates wild birds?

cjhills · Post by **cjhills** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 12:22 pm

A lot of states it is illegal......................Cj

GSP4ME · Post by **GSP4ME** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 1:01 pm

Thanks, looks like it's a no-no for me. Dang it.

Dogs may not be used in taking bear, deer,
elk, antelope and turkey.
Except as otherwise provided, nothing shall
prohibit the year-round pursuit of game (species
that can be lawfully hunted with dogs) for dog
training or sport only. However, unless otherwise
provided, no person in pursuit of game with hunting
dogs outside the regular harvest season shall
possess the means to harvest such game.

Boolywooger · Post by **Boolywooger** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 2:39 pm

Having a few dead pigeons and a blank pistol, wouldn't be illegal according to what you posted.

GSP4ME · Post by **GSP4ME** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 4:35 pm

Good point Booly.

DonF · Post by **DonF** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 7:20 pm

What would be illegal about it? sounds like a good idea to me. Is that your pup in your avatar? Great looking pup!

Post by **mnaj_springer** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 7:52 pm

May not be illegal there, but I know a DNR here in MN may start asking a lot of questions.

GSP4ME · Post by **GSP4ME** » Wed Sep 24, 2014 6:31 am

DonF wrote:What would be illegal about it? sounds like a good idea to me. Is that your pup in your avatar? Great looking pup!

Yep, that's him and thanks. I think that was at about 4 or 5 months.

Here he is on the second and third covey he found the other day. Been really happy with him to this point and he's done a wonderful job of getting my butt in shape.

913_1.JPG

913_3.JPG

RayGubernat · Post by **RayGubernat** » Wed Sep 24, 2014 7:12 am

DonF wrote:What would be illegal about it? sounds like a good idea to me. Is that your pup in your avatar? Great looking pup!

The section about not possessing the means to harvest such game is the issue I think.

I agree that a blank pistol and some dead pigeons would work pretty well also. To the OP: Keep in mind that you do not need(or want) the youngster to make a retrieve every single time a bird is shot at. Every second or third time is plenty nd probably better training anyway.

RayG

GSP4ME · Post by **GSP4ME** » Wed Sep 24, 2014 8:30 am

^ You mean just so that he gets used to the fact that I'm gonna miss from time to time and he can get back to hunting instead of looking for a dead bird that isn't there?

GrayDawg · Post by **GrayDawg** » Wed Sep 24, 2014 8:54 am

GSP4ME wrote:So I took my 10 month old mutt on his first dove hunt.........

Hey- just curious......... your dog looks like a GSP to me? Why did you refer to him as a "mutt"?
Is he a GSP/Pointer mix? Either way, he looks pretty nice!

GSP4ME · Post by **GSP4ME** » Wed Sep 24, 2014 9:43 am

GrayDawg wrote:
GSP4ME wrote:So I took my 10 month old mutt on his first dove hunt.........
Hey- just curious......... your dog looks like a GSP to me? Why did you refer to him as a "mutt"?
Is he a GSP/Pointer mix? Either way, he looks pretty nice!

Haha, yeah he was the result of an accidental breeding

BuddyPearl.png

I couldn't be happier with him and use it more as a term of endearment. I just freely admit that's what he is so as not to hear the "he looks like a little pointer got thrown in the mix somewhere". Shortly after I got him, I spoke with someone locally, about doing some training days with NAVHDA and the guy didn't hide his obvious negative attitude towards mixed breeds and unregistered dogs. Sort of got me off to the wrong start with the sporting dog world but I've got thick skin and as long as he doesn't eat too many socks, finds me birds, and keeps my wife and other dog company when im not around, I'll stay plenty happy with him.

Gooseman07 · Post by **Gooseman07** » Sun Sep 28, 2014 6:31 am

First, I want to reiterate the not shooting every bird for the pup. It keeps him on edge and allows him to steady up more and will create a better dog. Once he becomes steady, he will be much safer to hunt with other people and won't be breaking on the shot. This concerns me with my dogs because I do some guiding at preserves along with testing. That's another animal

Second, that is a very surprising reaction you received from a NAVHDA member. In my experience, they have always been willing to help anyone even remotely interested in training and hunting with dogs. I'm not sure where you are located but I would try again, look for a president of the club or it's hard to tell, but maybe a senior judge. They would be more apt to getting you involved. Who knows, you could turn out to be an upstanding member of the club who pushes it forward in times of struggle or something and you may one day purchase a full blood, papered dog and get into testing with the club. There are so many possibilities. If you have any questions about where to look or get started, send me a PM and I'll help.

DonF · Post by **DonF** » Sun Sep 28, 2014 9:25 am

I think the majority of finished dog's don't get to retrieve every bird. I used to let them retrieve every bird I shot. My though is that they really do learn to wait until sent. I think where the problem come's in a dog breaking is not from having every bird shot for it but rather hunting it and changing the rule's. You hunt and let the dog go on it's own then spring hit's and it's back to going only when sent. Then fall come's around again and we're back to going at the shot. To the dog, a bird is pretty much a bird I think. It doesn't distinguish between a pen raised bird and a wild bird. It does learn the difference in format though. Hunting and trialing run two different ways. We have different expectation's of the hunting dog and the trial dog. I think that is a mistake! If in either format you require the same preference from your dog, then the dog know's what you want from any situation. I have a number of trial friends I'll never convince that to! The most important thing to decide is are you willing to allow a bird to fly off if the dog foul's up? Most people aren't willing to do that. For your purpose's, view all birds as training birds. I'd have to say though, steady beyond the shot isn't all that important in hunting or in trials other than AKC. Most trials requiring a finished dog don't require retrieving. And seeing a lot of the AKC dog's retrieve I have to wonder why retrieving is required.

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