How to condition to E-collar?

[Soilman]

I have a Boykin that just turned 1 year old. I've been training him sans e-collars, but just purchased a sportdog model to re-enforce commands. This is my first attempt at training a retriever, so I'm taking it cautiouly so as to minimize mess ups. I plan on using the e-collar sparingly...to firm up commands the dog already knows, but sometimes decides to get stubborn about. My question is, how is the best way to "introduce" the dog to the e-collar? Do I just strap it on, and wait until the dog balks on a known command, then zap him with the lowest setting and adjust from there, or is there a better way to go about it? Do I need to strap it on and let him wear it a while to get used to it first? I assume I should start out with the "tone-zap" to begin with, then, once he gets the idea, try using tone only?

[DoubleBarrel GunDogs]

I have a Boykin that just turned 1 year old. I've been training him sans e-collars, but just purchased a sportdog model to re-enforce commands. This is my first attempt at training a retriever, so I'm taking it cautiouly so as to minimize mess ups. I plan on using the e-collar sparingly...to firm up commands the dog already knows, but sometimes decides to get stubborn about. My question is, how is the best way to "introduce" the dog to the e-collar?

By using the sequential steps of proven training program.

Do I just strap it on, and wait until the dog balks on a known command, then zap him with the lowest setting and adjust from there,

This is likely to end in disaster.

or is there a better way to go about it?

Yes, begin by attending a seminar or seek the help of a pro trainer.
George Hickox has a seminar in your area in April. Check out his website: www.georgehickox.com
I'm sure you'll get many other suggestions and recommendations on this.

Do I need to strap it on and let him wear it a while to get used to it first?

Yes, let him wear it for walks and running in the field. Place the collar high on his neck and above his regular collar if one is used. You should be able to easily slip two fingers under the collar when its on him. Run him with the collar in the off position until you know how to use it for correction.

I assume I should start out with the "tone-zap" to begin with, then, once he gets the idea, try using tone only?

Assumptions like this get a lot of people in trouble.

Good luck,

Nate

[gonehuntin']

I'm afraid you're going at this bass-akwards. You should have bought the books and dvd's first, then the fob, then the collar. Were I you, until I thoroughly understood and had a training program mapped out for you and the dog, I'd leave the transmitter at home and let the dog wear just the collar.

Easier to not do than to undo.

[ruffbritt4]

I have a Boykin that just turned 1 year old. I've been training him sans e-collars, but just purchased a sportdog model to re-enforce commands. This is my first attempt at training a retriever, so I'm taking it cautiouly so as to minimize mess ups. I plan on using the e-collar sparingly...to firm up commands the dog already knows, but sometimes decides to get stubborn about. My question is, how is the best way to "introduce" the dog to the e-collar? Do I just strap it on, and wait until the dog balks on a known command, then zap him with the lowest setting and adjust from there, or is there a better way to go about it? Do I need to strap it on and let him wear it a while to get used to it first? I assume I should start out with the "tone-zap" to begin with, then, once he gets the idea, try using tone only?

I agree with everything else, and would add that you want the dog to listen to commands all the time. I would think that using the tone will teach the dog he doesnt have to until it starts to beep. Good luck

[Sharon]

PM sent Too long to post here.

[Soilman]

Thanks guys. I purchased and read "Water Dog" and "Game Dog" long before I got my dog. I have also bought and viewed "Fowl Dog #1". None of them went into much detail about E-collars. Fowl Dog did a little on the collars, but I'd rather ask stupid questions and feel confident I'm on the right track than be prideful and mess up a good dog.

I have most of the basic training down, but we need to firm up a few areas. He does sit, stay, come fairly consistently and we are just beginning to work on remote sit and some short blind retrieves. He wants to break a bit on thrown bumpers, and on the blind retrieves, he is more interested in finding the bumper than returning to my "come" when he heads off in the wrong direction. I expect him to come when I call EVERY time, no matter what.

[EvanG]

Thanks guys. I purchased and read "Water Dog" and "Game Dog" long before I got my dog. I have also bought and viewed "Fowl Dog #1". None of them went into much detail about E-collars. Fowl Dog did a little on the collars, but I'd rather ask stupid questions and feel confident I'm on the right track than be prideful and mess up a good dog.

The right materials will go into far greater depth than any of those. The Smartwork system covers e-collar conditioning in great detail, command by command, starting with "Here" for pups as young as 4 months. All the skills and all the appropriate tools are taught.



And this is just a portion of this one command. Dogs conditioned this way are reliable and stable, and have good attitudes.

EvanG

[Rick S]

Follow a proven program! Especially if you've never done it before. Mike Lardy has a video that is dedicated to collar conditioning.

[CDN_Cocker]

Nothing will replace good hands -on experience with a pro or someone else that has been down that road. I read every piece of information I could but when it was time, my mentor gave me the real low-down on e-collar use and how to properly condition the dog to it. There's probably other things that should be tweaked with your dog that another set of eyes would also help with. My advice would be to find a HRC training group near you - they will be more than happy to help and show you the ins and outs.

[wildwindgundogs]

new thing followed by the old thing, its all about building a association

[roaniecowpony]

Im a follower of George Hickox's method for this. But Evan's methods are also well respected.

The comment about getting real hands-on experience with a pro is spot on in my opinion. You have already expressed your tentativeness in using an e-collar. This is normal and probably a good thing. But effective e-collar use requires overcoming that tentative approach. The e-collar must be used with timely and appropriate levels of stimulation. If the stimulation is not timely, the dog won't associate the bad behavior with the correction. If the stimulation level is too low to correct the behavior, you are on a path to harden the dog to e-collars and build non-compliance. Too high and you could cowar or shut down the dog. All of this is best done with direct hands on experience under the guidance of a pro or experienced person.

...and NO, don't just strap it on the dog and zap him when he disobeys a command. Follow a proven program. Collar conditioning is a process that differs from compliance correction use.

[Gordon Guy]

Check out this you tube video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfZN7trMOA0 And there are several more by other individuals as well on or in You Tube to view

The trainer is Tom Waite, a professional dog trainer out of WI. This may give you some insight on collar conditioning.

in my humble opinion, Buy new books There's better stuff out there.

[crackerd]

I have a Boykin that just turned 1 year old. I've been training him sans e-collars, but just purchased a sportdog model to re-enforce commands. This is my first attempt at training a retriever, so I'm taking it cautiouly so as to minimize mess ups. I plan on using the e-collar sparingly...to firm up commands the dog already knows, but sometimes decides to get stubborn about. My question is, how is the best way to "introduce" the dog to the e-collar?

Remember, you said this Boykin is your first effort to train a retriever. Use the e-collar on a Boykin as do the pointer people - including Hickox - and you're almost guaranteed to have great disappointment in your training going forward - if you can get the dog to go any further in advanced training because of what the e-collar and your use of it has wrought with a retriever.

Collar conditioning as espoused by retriever trainers is a different kettle of fish and, for the 3,000th time, retriever trainers make use of the e-collar in a proactive rather than the reactive way that it's used by pointing dog trainers. Which means you don't use e-collar stimulation applied directly to the dog for making a correction in training the dog up. But you best not let collar conditioning blow up on you first before going any further. Get Evan Graham's work or Mike Lardy's tapes - they have small differences in methodology but the outcome for collar conditioning a retriever is the same.

MG