Confinement

Spud · Post by **Spud** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 1:14 pm

Have a lot of questions @ training, but they'd compile a very large post, so here's my first: should gundogs be confined or allowed to run loose. We live in a rural area and have allowed our ES to do so. No worry about car traffic, etc. We've had her since puppyhood, she's 16 months now. So far no problems. Have I screwed up? Would appreciate some thoughts. Have other questions for later. Thanks.

Karen · Post by **Karen** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 1:20 pm

You just open the door and let her run and hope she comes back? If that's the case, not in a billion years would I do that. If she crosses paths with a deer and takes chase, she may never make it home.

If you have her boundary trained and in sight (with a reliable recall) as she runs, that's different.

WildRose · Post by **WildRose** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 1:42 pm

I realize that a lot of "country folks" seem to think it's natural and normal to let dogs roam freely.

It is however a recipie for disaster and you cannot have a properly trained birddog if you let them roam without supervision. Inevitibly they end up self hunting and developing a lot of bad habits at a minimum. At worst particularly with a high drive dog they are going to eventually roam too far and fall prey to predators or vehicles.

Of course you also run the risk of her finding someone out hunting who out of the kindness of their hearts will load her up and take her home figuring the owner doesn't care enough about her to keep her kenneled. CR

Ridgeviewer · Post by **Ridgeviewer** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 2:16 pm

WildRose & Karen are absolutely right. My hard headed Brother in Law and I both hunt english setters. My setters are contained, and supervised. His runs free and hunts for herself all day, most every day. I can't tell you how irritated I get, (and our hunting buddys) watching my BIL running to keep up with his dog, while she is running birds out the far side of the field.

He gets mad at his dog, then in turn at me, when I tell him that I can fix him, (my Brother in Law) if he'd wear my shock collar for a few hunts...

Teach your dog the fun is had hunting with the guy that feeds him!

Ridge

Spud · Post by **Spud** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 2:38 pm

Karen wrote:You just open the door and let her run and hope she comes back? If that's the case, not in a billion years would I do that. If she crosses paths with a deer and takes chase, she may never make it home.

Yes, each day we open the door and let her rip, with fingers crossed, hoping upon hope that in her uninhibited travels she remembers where her food dish is. Actually, Lucy's been trained to not chase deer. Do appreciate your concern.

Wild Rose, your point concerning her becoming too independent in her hunting is well taken. This is what I was wanting to find out about: whether too much freedom might be detrimental to her hunting correctly. I understand your concerns about a dogs safety and appreciate it. As "country folks" for a long time we've just about seen it all, and understand the risks.

WildRose · Post by **WildRose** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:14 pm

Well if you understand the risks, particularly since the reintroduction of the wolf into your area the only common sense approach is to fence your yard adequately or put in a kennel.

There's simply nothing good that can come from letting the dog roam free. CR

kiddcline · Post by **kiddcline** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:27 pm

I hunt labs and have noticed quite a difference in the dogs we used to hunt that free roamed the neighborhood. Now I hunt labs that are always confined unless being trained or worked. There is a complete difference in how well they listen, hunt, and work.
When they roam they become independent and become the head of the pack because they get to do what they want. If you keep them confined and with you at all times they learn that you are the one in charge.

Almost all training books and articles will tell you to make sure that you are the head of the pack.

Spud · Post by **Spud** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 4:11 pm

Thanks, Cam, just the kind of info I was looking for.

WildRose wrote:Well if you understand the risks, particularly since the reintroduction of the wolf into your area the only common sense approach is to fence your yard adequately or put in a kennel.

There's simply nothing good that can come from letting the dog roam free. CR

You mean there're really wolves up here?

luke0927 · Post by **luke0927** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 5:06 pm

i posted almost the exact same questions we have about 30 acres at my house and our dogs have always just ran around slept on the porch etc...and at first my GSP's were running around during the day and then i just put them up at night. Then my males would get into a fight.... I have now started being focused on turnign them into bird dogs and they are kenneled unless im there to handle them on the CC.

Spud · Post by **Spud** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 5:28 pm

luke0927 wrote:i posted almost the exact same questions we have about 30 acres at my house and our dogs have always just ran around slept on the porch etc...and at first my GSP's were running around during the day and then i just put them up at night. Then my males would get into a fight.... I have now started being focused on turnign them into bird dogs and they are kenneled unless im there to handle them on the CC.

Thanks, Luke. Gonna get off my duff and go do some engineerin'. Adios.

bobman · Post by **bobman** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 5:41 pm

Once a dog has its own opinion you are in trouble, never let your dog form his own opinion, if hes running loose that is exactly what will happen

letting dog run loose will create a total hardheaded self hunting worthless mutt that will end up getting shot by some deer hunter / farmer / whoever the dog is aggravating.

Spud I am as country as they get, if you really "understood the risks" you never would of asked the question.

Spud · Post by **Spud** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 6:29 pm

bobman wrote:.... if you really "understood the risks" you never would of asked the question.

Actually, I'm sorry I did. I'm sure that not one person, including you, who responded here knows the "whole" story and I did not feel it necessary to explain "everything". I thought "asking questions" was part of the reason for these forums. That being said, I got my answers. Now I go to da couch. Thanks LOADS for the help

mrsb73122 · Post by **mrsb73122** » Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:56 pm

Try not to be offended. They're just concerned for your dog. Consider yourself fortunate that something hasn't happened to your dog yet. I believe a hunting dog's desire to hunt could really get them into trouble if allowed to run free -- like somebody's chickens or chasing other livestock. My dad shot one of our dogs when I was growing up because a neighbor told him our dog was chasing his milk cows. In some rural neighborhoods here in OK dogs will get together and roam the neighborhoods getting into trouble. Who knows when they might encounter a wolf, mountain lion, bear, etc. -- all of which are in Idaho. Confinement would be the safest way to go plus it keeps them from hunting for themselves as has already been mentioned. Better safe than sorry.

gonehuntin' · Post by **gonehuntin'** » Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:12 am

I did a post once on the tremendous bond dog's form with the trainer when they live on board a dog truck. They rely on the trainer for food, water, attention, airing, exercise, training, and comfort.

By letting a dog run free you have removed all reliance on you. The only reason he has to come back is for food if he doesn't find some rotting carcass to feast on. His training will really suffer.

Even where you live, the chances are the dog will be stollen, poisened, caught in a trap, shot, or hit by a car. It's a terrible idea to let any dog run loose. There are only negatives to it, no positives. If you like and value your dog, keep him penned.

TheShadow · Post by **TheShadow** » Thu Nov 29, 2007 11:48 am

since i got my pup home i've controlled her every action. for the first say 6mo i've had a CC on her and it would drag when we'd be outside.

today after doing all the work on OB and ecollar i let her roam freely in the fields for fun. but she always will "check" me and not stray tooooo far from me. And when I say HERE she bolts back to me like a rocket. I think if you just let the dog do whatever it wants in open land, its gonna be hard to get that dog under control as it never learned "self control", respect, and bond? Others hit it pretty good.