GSP pointing question

wallihunter · Post by **wallihunter** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 5:48 pm

First post and I hope some one is willing to pass on some knowledge. I have a year old GSP that will come, whoa and heel for the most part--we continue to train. I have had him out on two pheasant hunts the first we did not see any birds and yesterday at least 15 flushed none in front of the dog. My concern is that two of the birds should have been scented due to the wind and his location however he passed by and the pheasants later flushed. I didn't shoot at any of the birds because i have read you dont want to enforce not pointing. Should I be worried that he is not pointing at this point? What can I do to help him learn to point? I should also note that he does sight point in our back yard--birds, squirrels. I did a search prior to this post and I apologize if this has already been answered. Any help would be appreciated.

Toyman · Post by **Toyman** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 6:28 pm

Has your pup been allowed to chase any birds? Have you worked the pup on any carded pigeons or pigeons in a launcher? Give a little more info on what you have done with the pup. My take is that dogs don't learn to point; they learn that they can not catch the bird therefore they point. You may need to fire him up by letting him chase and catch a bird and then work him on birds that he can not catch and he will begin to point. Ask more questions and I'm sure there will be a lot of advice.

Toyman

wallihunter · Post by **wallihunter** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 6:54 pm

I have not used any pigeons I guess because I am not quite sure where to find usable birds and a launcher however if you think this would help I will begin the work to find them and a launcher. I did allow him to chase the pheasants he saw yesterday. One last question i have read pro and cons to using a wing and fishing pole is this something you would recommend and if so what is the proper technique. Thanks

Toyman · Post by **Toyman** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 7:47 pm

Most people use the wing and pole just to see the pointing instinct in their pup. This is just sight pointing and most put it away after a very few times. What method of training are you trying to use to train your dog?

Addict · Post by **Addict** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 7:55 pm

Wallihunter,

If your looking to get pigeons give us your location and maybe one of the members can hook you up. If noone is able to help call your local pest control companies. They usually can point you to someone that can catch feral pigeons for a resonable price.

Addict

wallihunter · Post by **wallihunter** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 8:07 pm

I have been trying to model my training according to the delmar Smith book. In it he discusses using live birds and having a partner get the dog fired up and throwing the bird which is weighted down and holding the dog. The problem is being a city dweller getting a partner willing to give time to assist and what i talked about earlier finding usable birds. My only other alternative may be a professional trainer but i would prefer to not go that route due to the expense. Thanks for taking the time to help out a newby trainer.

TAK · Post by **TAK** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 8:18 pm

One thing that I try to do myself is always gove the dog the benifit of the dought. You felt that the dog should have winded the 2 birds.... Well I believe if he did wind the birds he would have done different with them.

Toyman · Post by **Toyman** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 8:20 pm

While I have and have read the Delmar Smith book I use the West/Gibbons/ Lindley silent method of training. I will be glad to discuss this method with you. Someone who uses the Smith method may want to jump in. How involved (far along) are you in this method? How much training have you actually done with your pup?

Post by **ezzy333** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 8:35 pm

Lets not try to make it too complicated. It sounds like the pup just needs some exposure to birds. You can continue to do what you did with it and take oit out in the field or try using some planted birds. Either will work. To me not pointing is not a problem till you know for sure he smelled the birds and has had the chance to flush a few he has found. Once you know he has scented a bird and continues to flush them, then you have a problem that will require some training. If this is the pups first experience seeing birds in a field what it did is probably normal.

I agree with TAK. I think we dream up a lot of problems sometimes that will slove themselves if you give the dog half a chance. Sometimes we also seem to spend all of our time training instead of enjoying and letting the pup figure it out.

Ezzy

wallihunter · Post by **wallihunter** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 8:37 pm

obedience training daily since i got him at 3 months ie whoa, come, heel and kennel. This summer utilized the whoa post with pinch collar to reinforce whoa and about 3 sessions of retrieving training a week for the past two months. I realize Delmer felt one should wait with some of this training until the dog is a year old however i wanted to jump start it so he could get some exposure to hunting this fall. I am thinking tomorrow i will use the phone and begin my search for pigeons and a laucher. I think in reading some of the replies i just need to relax and the dog will point in time with some time, training and guidance. Thanks again all.

Mary · Post by **Mary** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 8:40 pm

Here is a url for Rick Smith's forum http://66.146.162.211/forum/
This is a very informative and helpfull site. If you can make it to one of Rick's seminars they are well worth it.
One way you can catch pigeons is to put traps under overpasses when you release them they will be gone though. I have a friend who lives in a city and regularly traps pigeons under overpasses.
Mary

TAK · Post by **TAK** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 9:50 pm

What ever way you choose to train the dog is great! Just force feed the young pup birds! and then even more birds, when he is so wound up with chasing and going after birds(make a bird finder out of them), then start to make them do it right. That is if he does not figure it out on his own.

Casper · Post by **Casper** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 11:38 pm

Getting your pup a jump start with all the whoa and heal so on is realy not neaded. All dogs develope at different rates.

Since you are using the Smith training I would encourage you to get the videos. The videos show you how to go about your training. Than go to http://ricksmithseminars.com/ for a seminar near you. The hands on instruction wil give you a whole new perspective on the "how to" parts.

markj · Post by **markj** » Mon Oct 24, 2005 2:38 pm

where do you live? here is what works for me, i go and buy a dozen quail, I tie strings onto their legs, I tie cardboard onto the strings so they do not get to high off the ground, then I put several into my 30 by 60 barn with a dog, then stand back and watch. The bird will run etc, teh dog will find it as a playful thing and begin to enjoy catching the bird, I also ask the dog to fetch it up to my hand, this will tell you how the dogs mouth is, I havent lost a quail yet

good dogs

I have some pups at 4 weeks, I put a wore out quail in with them, one male pointed then barked and attacked

the others joined right in. This will be a great litter of hunters

sorry all spoken for or I wouldnt have had a litter with my best hunter at this time of year.....