Breeding Labradors

logan's best friends · Post by **logan's best friends** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 5:29 pm

Hi, we just got a yellow male lab and are not thinking of breeding him until he's already had his hips cert. But we do in a year or so want to get a female to adventually breed him to. Does anyone know if it's bad to breed yellow with anything, but yellow. Or is black ok. and how do you know what they'll produce? I heard that it's not good to breed chocolates with anything other than is that true? just wondering. Any info would be great..

sudiegirl · Post by **sudiegirl** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 6:31 pm

exactly what are you trying to achieve with this breeding? i would not recommend breeding any animal because it is a certain color. the last time i checked, it was not "bad" to breed yellow to chocolate or black to black or chocolate to black or yellow to whatever, but it is bad to breed for color alone. obviously, you should make sure that your dog's hips and eyes are certified and that he has a good temperment. also, you should learn more about the breed itself(standards and whatnot) as well as about the particular lines of the breed that you have (and the lines of your future female) before you ever attempt to breed your animals. after you understand that, you need to study both of your animals' pedigrees to make sure that you are not breeding any trait into the line that is undesirable. i would talk to some reputable lab breeders and learn what they had to offer. basicly, do not breed you dog just because you want some yellow or chocolate puppies, but because the result of the litter will be in furtherance of the breed, producing animals that meet all standards and qualitiies desired in your particular breed.

Colleen · Post by **Colleen** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 7:01 pm

I was told by a labrador breeder that you can breed any combination of yellow, black and chocolate, and the litter will be a mix of yellow and black. In other words, even if you breed two yellow labs, you could end up with some black pups, and two black labs can produce yellow pups. Black is the dominant color. But, she told me that in order to produce chocolate labs you must breed two chocolate labs.

TAK · Post by **TAK** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 7:37 pm

not an for sure answer here but a old friend that breeds and trials Labs said never breed a Yellow to a Chocolate. I believe he told me that the pups have pink noses and something else??? Just a guess.
One other thing he did say is never breed for color and the only good color in Labs is Black.

Country-Side Breeders · Post by **Country-Side Breeders** » Sat Oct 30, 2004 12:03 am

Based on experience on breeding Labs in the past...you don't need to breed a chocolate to a chocolate to get them. You can breed a pair of blacks and still get chocolates and yellows...and the same with mixing the other colors. I do know that the black is the dominant color, then yellow and finally chocolate. From my experience, the yellow are very mellow (like the black) and the chocolate are very high strung and moody, especially as the mature. However, as Sudie mentioned, you don't want to breed for just the color, unless you are going to keep just one pup, sterilize it and cull the rest. Then, I don't see an issue. You're breeding to get the color that you're looking for and not passing on litter that hasn't been bred to improve the breed. Your best bet to see what sort of coloring you're going to get is to look back many generations at the pedigrees and see who produced what from each side. There is a good site that explains why black is dominant and the results you will achieve by mixing different colors at: http://www.labbies.com/genetics.htm .

logan's best friends · Post by **logan's best friends** » Sat Oct 30, 2004 12:16 am

OK..I think you are on the wrong path. I got my dog for his hunting lines which are excellent. I would make sure who I bred him to was also from excellent hunting lines. I was asking about color because I have heard that you can end up with bad pigmentation. Which would make poor quality pups and dudleys..yellows with pink noses and eyes. Just asking for advice, because I have heard many different things. Our goal is to pass on excellent labs with great lines and dispositions. Never hurts to get more info... His sire is black and has been bredd before to black females and thrown chocolates. It confusing..I guess I should get him genetically tested to find out his dna..that might provide me with more info...

Country-Side Breeders · Post by **Country-Side Breeders** » Sat Oct 30, 2004 12:22 am

Head to that website that I listed...it shows 80 different combos. and the results.

Sorry to have gotten off track in assuming you were only breeding for color.

A DNA profile is a good idea even if you don't need the extra info on him...if provides an extra security measure for you in that the stud used is the actual stud listed on the papers. Too many folks out there that take backyard dogs and put their names on decent dog papers...only to find out down the road that the 2 don't match up and then there's a mess on your hands.

logan's best friends · Post by **logan's best friends** » Sat Oct 30, 2004 12:43 am

Read the info..my brain hurts. Thanks though it makes more sense. It pretty much sounds like breeding him to either a black only lined female or black and yellow with no chocolate sounds the best. I am going to find out what he carries and make sure the female is what I just said. Sounds that way we'll end up with good pigments. Who knows by the time I go to do this they'll say silver labs are best..just lidding..majorly!

TAK · Post by **TAK** » Sat Oct 30, 2004 12:46 am

Tell us what you have heard about the collor of the Eyes and Nose??? It intrests me

logan's best friends · Post by **logan's best friends** » Sat Oct 30, 2004 1:01 am

That if you breed a chocolate with two ressive(sp?) genes with a yellow and a puppy is born with a yellow and and two ressive chocolate gene. It will be a yellow with the chocolate pigmant, sometimes being pink and they refer them as dudely's and they are disqualified by AKC standards..It's confusing when everyone gives you advice and you're not sure who's right. Look at:
www.woodhavenlabs.com.yellow-pigment.html that's where I saw the pigment pictures. doesn't really say how to avoid..all this gene stuff is so packed you almost have to be a scientist..

sudiegirl · Post by **sudiegirl** » Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:22 pm

sorry from me too... breeding for color is what i got out of your original post. that is great that you know so much about the lines. you should also talk to your breeder about what has happened with past breedings bla bla as far as what colors they have gotten with which breedings. if i remember correctly. you should be able to guestimate by putting a punnet square together if you know the recessive and dominant genes of the parents and grandparents too i think?? dna testing both dogs though should give you plenty of info i would think! once you find out the information you can figure out the possibilities. who does the dna testing, and how long does it take to get back the results?

logan's best friends · Post by **logan's best friends** » Sun Oct 31, 2004 2:27 am

I'm not sure there is a lot of stuff on line, but I'm sure his vet can lead me in the right direction. Although, they all seem to have different vaccine ideas too. The breeder we got him from is also a retriever, hunt test trainers. We didn't exactly end up on the best terms. My husband I had pick of the yellow males, we picked the one we wanted and took him back that evening. She said they all came down with Giardia and that he had a harder time with it and he had a firm stool that morning or she wouldn't have let him go. But when I picked him up and took him to my husband my husband immediatley called her and she said he may have not gotten rid of it all or he may have coccidia, if we wanted to take him to the vet she'd pay for it but she was leaving the next morning to wis. and Cal. to do hunt test. So, we could get another puppy if we felt more comfortable. So, we did. The puppy we got looked a lot fatter. They said he was getting all the groceries. Anyway, 5 days after him having yucky stool we took him to the vet. They were called prior and no response on their part was made until a couple days later. The vet told us he had giardia and them being treated with panacur for 5 days was not sufficiant enough. The pup had a health guarantee for 7 days. She also told us on the other pup she'd pay for the vet bill. We felt she should be responisble and not treating them correctly, and letting them go home with out making 100 percent sure they were healthy wasn't right. Anyway they think we were out of line and are not happy with us. But they're paying for the bill after threats of court. After they said bring the pup back we'll give you your money back and we'll pay the vet bill....3 wks later...We felt it was bad business...So they're not a great source!!!! I wish it would've because my dog will need a hunt test trainer...

TAK · Post by **TAK** » Sun Oct 31, 2004 4:37 am

There are many trainers in the WA area I am sure. I can not name them but I bet you could find one close.
The net is a great place to find this.......
This may be a sign that it is time you take a chance and train this dog yourself. Find a retrieve club and jump on, sure there will be dues but the experiance and the many minds at work most always makes for great training. Kinda like this board!

logan's best friends · Post by **logan's best friends** » Mon Nov 01, 2004 7:15 pm

Thanks for the advice. Is there a group in WA? Where may I find one?

logan's best friends · Post by **logan's best friends** » Mon Nov 01, 2004 7:17 pm

thanks.

Country-Side Breeders · Post by **Country-Side Breeders** » Mon Nov 01, 2004 7:30 pm

There is a club in the Sound...http://www.pslra.org/...see if that will work for you.

logan's best friends · Post by **logan's best friends** » Mon Nov 15, 2004 12:21 am

I have contacted pslra and they sound wonderful. Thanks for the great direction. The dues are $25.00 per family and that to me seems pretty cheap. The info and things they provide sound well worth it. Thanks again.Sheree

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