Partial CCL (ACL) Tear??

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Taylor_B
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Partial CCL (ACL) Tear??

Post by Taylor_B » Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:34 pm

Hi All -
Figured this gang would have some good insight/advice. Our Lab/Weim mix is 6 years old (7 in March). During her past 3 hunts here in western PA, she's been limping pretty good on her back left leg for about 3 to 4 days afterwards. During the hunt, she's all business. Couldn't slow her up if you tried. But afterwards, upon getting home and the first day afterwards, she's totally lame on her left back leg and barely uses it. After that, she has another day or two of limping around, but uses the leg more. Usually by day 5, she's good to go and back to her normal self. We took her to the vet today as this has happened for the 3rd time. He said it doesn't appear to be her foot or hip, and seems like it could be a partial CCL tear, some arthritis, or a little combo of both. We did perform a SNAP test for Lymes, Anaplasmosis, Ehrlichiosis and Heartworm: all negative (and she religiously receives her flea, tick, heartworm meds).

Also, when she's playing with our other pup in the yard, or out for shorter hikes, it's not a problem. This really only crops up after a longer hunt.

Just curious what you folks think on this? It's a new vet we're seeing (we've recently moved). I'm not sure about him yet as he was very brief. When I asked if we should be more aggressive with the partial CCL tear diagnosis (rather than just wait for it to potentially tear completely) he said to just give her the anti-inflammatory and joint supplement (she's already on one) and see how she does. She's very active, LOVES to hunt and be out in the woods in the offseason. She would be devastated to be sidelined for the recovery of a full tear, so if we can head this off before it would totally rip, then I would obviously prefer that.

Not sure if we should pursue this further? And if so...what are the options? Is an MRI required or should a doc be able to diagnose pretty well via physical exam?

Thanks!
Brooke

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Sharon
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Re: Partial CCL (ACL) Tear??

Post by Sharon » Tue Jan 26, 2021 7:10 pm

If the vet was really concerned they would do an x ray or MRI. However, if you are really concerned no reason you can't request an x ray or mri. It has been my experience that vets don't like to jump to the worst case scenario unless the problem is very clear. They often prefer to wait and see; an approach I prefer.
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Garrison
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Re: Partial CCL (ACL) Tear??

Post by Garrison » Tue Jan 26, 2021 10:57 pm

Hopefully it’s nothing serious, I had a dog blow one out and found out that it’s quite common for the other leg to go after the first. Which unfortunately it did. Might want to give this some time to heal and only do leashed walks for awhile.

Garrison
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Cicada
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Re: Partial CCL (ACL) Tear??

Post by Cicada » Wed Jan 27, 2021 9:51 am

I am in the same shoes and I decided to hold off and wait. My dog as stopped limping but you can see a small hing in his gate. The x-ray will show up any arthritis but not the minor tears. The closest CCL repair clinic is 3 1/2 hours away and cost will be north of $4,000 and that come into play with a dog going on to its 7th or 8th hunting season.


Grant

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Re: Partial CCL (ACL) Tear??

Post by dog dr » Thu Jan 28, 2021 8:44 am

if you really want to pursue it, the next step would be x-ray and or MRI. If its a partial tear of the ACL, only treatment that i know of would be possibly stem cell injections into the joint, maybe platelet rich plasma, somethingn like that. no reason to go thru the trauma of surgery for a partial tear that causes her no problems until later. Personally I would get an x-ray at the very least, just to make sure its not the hip or something else.

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Taylor_B
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Re: Partial CCL (ACL) Tear??

Post by Taylor_B » Thu Jan 28, 2021 9:59 am

Thanks for the insight!
So we went ahead and made the drive to consult with our prior vet that we had been seeing before we moved.
They took x-rays and confirmed the following:
-She has early degenerative changes consistent with a partial tear to her ACL.
-Her hips are not perfect, but not bad at all. And the hip with more issues is actually her right hip (which she does not favor in any way).
-The vet at this clinic only offers one type of repair: She said Lucy would not be a candidate for it because of her size, activity level, and strength (she said she fears that the repair wouldn't hold for her long term).

Now here's my question:
-She also indicated that an early tear will really not repair itself and eventually, with her level of activity, will fully tear. She cautioned against waiting for a full tear because in that period of time between now and the full tear, she will develop additional degenerative changes, and risk putting more strain on the "good knee" (risking a tear in that leg as well).

@Doc Dr: What are your thoughts on this? The pain in the leg does bother her for nearly 4 or 5 days after a hunt. But once she's rested, she's back to her normal self. Until we get her back out in the woods. We intend to continue hunting with her (she loves it - it's her favorite thing) but we obviously don't want to compromise her comfort. We hunt with our dogs because THEY also love it, not just for us. Would you think it's valuable to pursue surgery earlier than later? Or wait it out?

As an aside, I'll have to look into those treatments, however, I'm fairly certain they're not conveniently available nearby.

Thank you again!
Brooke

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Cicada
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Re: Partial CCL (ACL) Tear??

Post by Cicada » Fri Jan 29, 2021 10:04 am

The only suggestion/alternative my vet gave me was to look at knee braces for dogs not so sure they would work in the bush.

Grant

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Re: Partial CCL (ACL) Tear??

Post by dog dr » Mon Feb 01, 2021 11:38 am

Nothing is gonna stop the DJD... except maybe the stem cell therapy, and she’ll have arthritis in that knee wether you do surgery or not. There’s also a 65-70 % chance she’ll tear it in the other knee. Surgery will help stabilize the joint, but it won’t “heal” it, if that mAkes sense. Personally, I’d get her on a GOOD joint supplement and use NSAIDS as needed, enjoy her as much as you can. Just out of curiosity, has she been spayed, and if so at what age did that occur?

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