Dog food formula changes

[Hondo]

I was curious as to how often and why dog food formulas are changed. Is it prevelent within the industry? Does one company make more changes than another?

I would think that once a company had a great formula they would just keep it the same. Why change what isn't broken?

As far as I can tell from everyone's posts, is that it is primarily money motivated. Which to me is sad since a formula change should be what is best for the dog.

-Hondo

[Cajun Casey]

Most of the brands I sell make lable worthy changes every couple of years or so, if not more often. It is cost related, for the most part. Do you really think Proctor and Gamble, Coalgate Palmolive, M&M Mars or Nestles gives a rat's heiny about anyone's dog on an individual basis? The small companies are concerned about their customers, but not enough to take a financial bath.

[ezzy333]

Hondo,

Changes are normally fone for a couple of reasons, either an ingredient is no longer available or sometime the feeding test will show a better way to provide what the dog needs and that may also encompass keeping the feed affordable. Changes to make the company more money just doesn't happen as every company opperates on a set markup and if the feed cost change then the price you will pay changes but the company wil still make about the same thing per ton. The overhead of the company is what determines the amount of markup. They have to pay their fixed costs, ingredient costs, labor costs and transportation cost and many have research costs. Those are the main ones. But you won't see the formula change normally unless there is an absolute need for whatever reason.

Ezzy

[Cajun Casey]

Science Diet changes their food so frequently, I've had three different packages on the shelf at the same time with an expire spread of under six months. They don't care how well a formula works, if it doesn't sell, they ditch it.

[ezzy333]

Science Diet changes their food so frequently, I've had three different packages on the shelf at the same time with an expire spread of under six months. They don't care how well a formula works, if it doesn't sell, they ditch it.

Doesn'r really matter how good a feed is if no one buys it. Sounds like they need a better arketing division.

Ezzy

[Cajun Casey]

If the conglomerates that market the big brands cared about dogs over profits, we wouldn't have things like Beneful.

[ezzy333]

If the conglomerates that market the big brands cared about dogs over profits, we wouldn't have things like Beneful.

Take it you don't like Beneful but I know people who use it and the dogs do well on it. For a matter of fact thaat is the first feed I fed my pup when I was out east to get him. He did well on it and after the first sack and I was home with him I switched to a Diamond product. But the Beneful did I nice job as the first feed.

I agree there are better feeds for a working dog but it works quite well for the small lap type dogs That I know that are eating it and have been for several years.

Ezzy

[Cajun Casey]

Take it you don't like Beneful but I know people who use it and the dogs do well on it.
Ezzy

Ya think? This is copied from NPPC's Beneful site.

GUARANTEED ANALYSIS

Crude Protein (Min) 25.0% Calcium (Ca) (Min) 1.1%
Crude Fat (Min) 10.0% Iron (Fe) (Min) 175 mg/kg
Crude Fiber (Max) 4.0% Selenium (Se) (Min) 0.2 mg/kg
Moisture (Max) 14.0% Vitamin A (Min) 10,000 IU/kg
Linoleic Acid (Min) 1.5% Vitamin E (Min) 100 IU/kg
CALORIE CONTENT
Metabolizable Energy (ME)
3689 kcal/kg
1674 kcal/lb
360 kcal/cup

INGREDIENTS
Ground yellow corn, chicken by-product meal, corn gluten meal, whole wheat flour, animal fat preserved with mixed-tocopherols (form of Vitamin E), rice flour, beef, soy flour, sugar, propylene glycol, meat and bone meal, tricalcium phosphate, phosphoric acid, salt, water, animal digest, sorbic acid (a preservative), potassium chloride, dried carrots, dried peas, calcium propionate (a preservative), L-Lysine monohydrochloride, choline chloride, added color (Red 40, Yellow 5, Yellow 6, Blue 2), DL-Methionine, Vitamin E supplement, zinc sulfate, ferrous sulfate, manganese sulfate, niacin, Vitamin A supplement, calcium carbonate, copper sulfate, Vitamin B-12 supplement, calcium pantothenate, thiamine mononitrate, garlic oil, pyridoxine hydrochloride, riboflavin supplement, Vitamin D-3 supplement, menadione sodium bisulfite complex (source of Vitamin K activity), calcium iodate, folic acid, biotin, sodium selenite.

There are several things that throw up caution lights in that list of ingredients.

[tro182]

[quote="ezzy333"]Hondo,

Changes to make the company more money just doesn't happen as every company opperates on a set markup and if the feed cost change then the price you will pay changes but the company wil still make about the same thing per ton.
[quote="ezzy333"]
I am goin to call BS here. Profit is made in one of two ways 1. raising the price 2. cuttin expenses. If the feed company can cut what some mey seem as a small expense that can make a big difference to the bottom line. Just one question, how many times have you seen a formula change and the price of the feed go down? That would be rare. When you make thousands of tons of product savings can make a big difference.

I do not think the feed companies and any big company in general are "EVIL". All companies should be out to make a profit or we would all be broke or work for the Government.

[mcbosco]

"Evil" might not be the right word but misleading, dishonest and unethical are certainly applicable to some of these companies.

Has anyone ever seen the Chef Michael's dog food commercial? That has to be the lowest of the low.

One thing I have to say is that P&G hasn't used the same tactics as Nestle. Anyone interested in business ethics should read about how Nestle marketed baby formula to third world mothers. Unreal stuff.

[ezzy333]

Ladies and Gentlemen ,

We can all find what we are looking for. I see, hear, and read things every day that I don't necessarily agree with. But I also know that 99% of the news today is put out by people with an agenda so I have learned to take it all with a grain of salt. From experience I do know a few things though and have tried to relate a very few of them here on the board with absolutely no agenda other than for education. Take and use what you want from it. I have never told anyone what to feed or what not to feed since I can not do that with any degree of accuracy since I do not have enough information or hands on experience with each and every product.

Just a few examples, I prefer to see a meat based product as the first ingredient. But if it isn't the first that does not mean the feed in question is bad or even poorer. I do know that feed developed for the working dog will be and should be different than one developed for the house pet. I do know that the worse feed on the market today is better than what anyone fed 50 years ago and yet we continue to idolize the dogs and their performances of that time. I do know I can find negative literature about any company in existence today but have no idea of the validity of that literature but do know the company is putting out a product that many people use and are very satisfied with the results. I do know when I evaluate a feed I do it on what it produces and not on what I Think the formula is or what I have heard or read about the company that makes it. There is much more that could be written but I think you get the idea. It's so very much like judging your friends, the best friend has had many negative things said or written about them and have a group of people who probably do not even like them, so tell me how much that influenced who your friend even is and how much of their baggage is even true.

When judging feed it is OK to pick what you think will e a good one and then make your final and probably accurate judgement after looking at your dog. It would be wise to not even try to make much of a judgement of the feeds you haven't tried or had experience with. And do not judge the feed on what you have read or heard about the company that makes it if they are still in business and have been for several years.

We all can find what we are looking for and if your purpose is to find fault you will find plenty but if your purpose is to find a feed for your dog that will do a good job there is an endless supply of them on the market today.

And one last thing which will really upset many of you but... you are feeding a dog. Dogs are made to eat all kinds of crappy things naturally but like most animals have the ability to pretty much balance their diet to provide what they need when given a chance. To do that they will eat an extremely wide range of foods from fruits, vegetables, meat, and every kind of rotten junk they can find. They seldom if ever have what we today like to call a sensitive stomach and they do not have other human conditions that we continually try to push on them. They are better than that. If we took half as much care in our own diets that we try to force on to our carrion eating, wood chewing, grass eating hunting companions it would be a miracle in the making. How many of you choose your own diet by the amount of waste it produces, where we are getting more animal protein or more vegetable protein,etc. etc. etc. For a matter of fact what percent protein do you need in your diet ? And what about the fat or red meat, which by the way they have proved is better at reducing cholesterol than most other meats. We feed our dogs a lot better than we eat. We have so many perceived problems with our dogs diet because we are pushing the envelope and trying to feed too much and too good rather than just what a dog needs. And most of it is done trying to find some magical formula that will make my dog perform better than yours when the real deciding factor is much more apt to be genetic or some other shortcoming.

Just some my thoughts as we continue the ongoing saga of my food is better than yours.

Ezzy

[Onk]

Very well said Ezzy! I agree with pretty much all of what you said!

[Cajun Casey]

The question was whether dog food manufacturers make formula changes in the best interest of profits over benefit to the dogs. They do. Since dog food is commodity based, formulas are often flexible enough to take advantage of commodity prices. Beneful is a prime example of this. Chef Michael's appears to be Beneful in designer colors, from what I've seen of the bag.

Some other foods that have made obvious the financial agenda of their manufacturers. When M&M Mars dropped the ball on contracts right after purchasing Nutro, they suspended several product SKUs and raised the price 15% across the board. Kasco ceased to be during one of the changes of ownership of Sensible Choice/Royal Canin. Iams and Eukanuba downsize their packaging annually.

As far as fifty years ago, my mother fed her collies day old cornbread and biscuits from a restaurant with horsemeat. They looked pretty good.

[AzDoggin]

If we took half as much care in our own diets that we try to force on to our carrion eating, wood chewing, grass eating hunting companions it would be a miracle in the making.

Ain't that the truth, Ezzy! Well said.

[CHJIII]

The question was whether dog food manufacturers make formula changes in the best interest of profits over benefit to the dogs. They do. Since dog food is commodity based, formulas are often flexible enough to take advantage of commodity prices. Beneful is a prime example of this. Chef Michael's appears to be Beneful in designer colors, from what I've seen of the bag.

Some other foods that have made obvious the financial agenda of their manufacturers. When M&M Mars dropped the ball on contracts right after purchasing Nutro, they suspended several product SKUs and raised the price 15% across the board. Kasco ceased to be during one of the changes of ownership of Sensible Choice/Royal Canin. Iams and Eukanuba downsize their packaging annually.

As far as fifty years ago, my mother fed her collies day old cornbread and biscuits from a restaurant with horsemeat. They looked pretty good.

My goodness, It's a joy for me to see you post!

[Cajun Casey]

The question was whether dog food manufacturers make formula changes in the best interest of profits over benefit to the dogs. They do. Since dog food is commodity based, formulas are often flexible enough to take advantage of commodity prices. Beneful is a prime example of this. Chef Michael's appears to be Beneful in designer colors, from what I've seen of the bag.

Some other foods that have made obvious the financial agenda of their manufacturers. When M&M Mars dropped the ball on contracts right after purchasing Nutro, they suspended several product SKUs and raised the price 15% across the board. Kasco ceased to be during one of the changes of ownership of Sensible Choice/Royal Canin. Iams and Eukanuba downsize their packaging annually.

As far as fifty years ago, my mother fed her collies day old cornbread and biscuits from a restaurant with horsemeat. They looked pretty good.

My goodness, It's a joy for me to see you post!

Thanks! I might have to send you a dog or three in appreciation!

[Coveyrise64]

The question was whether dog food manufacturers make formula changes in the best interest of profits over benefit to the dogs. They do. Since dog food is commodity based, formulas are often flexible enough to take advantage of commodity prices. Beneful is a prime example of this. Chef Michael's appears to be Beneful in designer colors, from what I've seen of the bag.

Some other foods that have made obvious the financial agenda of their manufacturers. When M&M Mars dropped the ball on contracts right after purchasing Nutro, they suspended several product SKUs and raised the price 15% across the board. Kasco ceased to be during one of the changes of ownership of Sensible Choice/Royal Canin. Iams and Eukanuba downsize their packaging annually.

As far as fifty years ago, my mother fed her collies day old cornbread and biscuits from a restaurant with horsemeat. They looked pretty good.

My goodness, It's a joy for me to see you post!

Thanks! I might have to send you a dog or three in appreciation!

Watch out CHJIII, it's a trap......

Coveyrise64

[CHJIII]

Cajin knows how well that would go over with the wife

[Cajun Casey]

Cajin knows how well that would go over with the wife

I'd hide 'em under a pile of feedsack reproduction quarters. How'd you get on here at this time of day?

[Hondo]

How is it that we as consumers become aware of these formula changes? Are they noted some where? I've read some posts where many forum members have switched to a different brand because of a formula change. How was the formula change discovered?

-Hondo

[Cajun Casey]

How is it that we as consumers become aware of these formula changes? Are they noted some where? I've read some posts where many forum members have switched to a different brand because of a formula change. How was the formula change discovered?

-Hondo

Many times it's noted on the bag. Other times, consumers will pick up on lable changes and it will hit the forums and discussion boards. Sometimes, companies will promote a change through media advertising, like when ProPlan changed their flagship formulas to "Shreded Blend."

[ezzy333]

And many times it is just a rumor.

Ezzy

[4ShotB]

Ladies and Gentlemen ,

How many of you choose your own diet by the amount of waste it produces, where we are getting more animal protein or more vegetable protein,etc. etc. etc. Ezzy

Normally i don't mess with my own diet too much but I have found my wife quit feeding me pintos or navy beans for dinner a long time ago!