Ear care for dogs that swim a lot

jlp8cornell · Post by **jlp8cornell** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 5:38 pm

What does anyone use to keep their dogs ears clean and dry,........Max swims 5+ days/week. I do not want to use alcohol based cleaners that much. Any ideas?

Thx..... (Max has a lot of of wax build-up and I clean his ears regularly).

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 5:51 pm

Mix up the blue stuff:

1 bottle of witch hazel or alcohol
16 drops of gentian violet
2-3 tablespoons of pharma grade boric acid, pharma grade!!!!

jlp8cornell · Post by **jlp8cornell** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 5:53 pm

Mix up the blue stuff:

1 bottle of witch hazel or alcohol
16 drops of gentian violet
2-3 tablespoons of pharma grade boric acid, pharma grade!!!!

Alcohol is too drying for daily use.......

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 5:58 pm

Use witch hazel then, but why would you use it everyday? Is the gunk he has brown?

jlp8cornell · Post by **jlp8cornell** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 6:00 pm

Yes...the "gunk" is brown. No odor, no pain/redness/swelling, ie: not infected. Just a lot of brown"gunk", ie:wax.

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 6:08 pm

If its brown and waxy its probably yeast messing in there. Unless a dog's ear is clean and dry I consider it "infected". It can get much worse unless you jump on it.

Try that stuff it really works well and its cheap. Once a day for a week. Then see how it looks.

birddog1968 · Post by **birddog1968** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 6:11 pm

I buy a big bottle of medicated ear wash from the vet and do my labs ears as needed.

jlp8cornell · Post by **jlp8cornell** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 6:12 pm

Will try.....

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 6:15 pm

jlp8cornell wrote:Will try.....

gentian violet is a pretty decent anti-fungal even if its old fashioned.

jlp8cornell · Post by **jlp8cornell** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 6:20 pm

gentian violet is a pretty decent anti-fungal even if its old fashioned

Sometimes you older folks have good ideas....

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 6:24 pm

just do it outside because it stains

jlp8cornell · Post by **jlp8cornell** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 6:27 pm

Thank you wise old man....

kumate · Post by **kumate** » Sun Jul 18, 2010 7:11 pm

Dantes ears were very gunky i use it almost daily it has helped alot

Jerry

jcbjr · Post by **jcbjr** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 12:25 am

Brown wax could be yeast, which is easily tested for by your vet. Yeast infection is pretty much always a secondary problem, with either allergies or constant swimming underlying. If he's not itchy, probably not allergy. Make sure you flush ears at the end of each swimming day; my favorite is EpiOtic. Add 50% white vinegar to suppress yeast growth. Don't use Balsimic; he might start barking in Italian. Also, mineral oil before flush if wax is heavy.

Good luck! Jim B. DVM

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 5:35 am

There is nothing wrong with barking in Italian so long as its Il trovatore

jlp8cornell · Post by **jlp8cornell** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 6:22 am

Brown wax could be yeast, which is easily tested for by your vet. Yeast infection is pretty much always a secondary problem, with either allergies or constant swimming underlying. If he's not itchy, probably not allergy. Make sure you flush ears at the end of each swimming day; my favorite is EpiOtic. Add 50% white vinegar to suppress yeast growth. Don't use Balsimic; he might start barking in Italian. Also, mineral oil before flush if wax is heavy.

It is mainly in his left ear. He had a bad infection as a pup in that ear. Is it possible he built up some scar tissue that may be causing some of the problem? His right ear is normal.

Chaingang · Post by **Chaingang** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 7:52 am

I think the protocol for using the Gentian Violet formula on yeasty ears is twice a day for the first 2 weeks followed by once a day for the next week. If all is working well then a once a month maintenance clean, otherwise a trip to the vet may be in order. If your dog swims frequently and is prone to yeast infections then it may be worth using right after a swim.

**** When using, Fill ear canal and massage base of the ear for 30 seconds and let dog shake the excess out. Fill ear canal again and let sit for another 30 seconds (no massaging) then let the dog shake it out, if needed wipe any excess out of the outer ear canal.

P. S. It may be hard to find Gentian Violet and or boric acid on the shelf, in that case your pharmacy should be able to order it for you if not available.

collinedward · Post by **collinedward** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 7:57 am

Both of my GSP's swim 4 to 5 times a week. My male is 7 y/o and has never had any ears issues. PetSmart sells an alcohol base cleaner/dryer that I have used since he was a baby.

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 7:58 am

Boric acid is good to keep around because you can make a great eye wash with it too with Goldenseal and sterile water.

Chaingang · Post by **Chaingang** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:02 am

I found where I kept the protocol for the Purple power wash.

Ear Cleanse Formula Purple Stuff

16 oz. bottle isopropyl alcohol (or witch hazel)
4 tablespoons Boric Acid Powder
16 drops Gentian Violet 1% Solution

Mix all ingredients in the alcohol bottle & shake. (make sure you shake before every application).
Treatment: Fill ear with solution & massage gently for 30 seconds and wipe with a tissue. Fill a second time and just wipe without massaging. The dog will shake the excess out. Be careful, the Gentian Violet could stain. I use a eye dropper to fill the ear.

Treatment:
2 times per day for the first 2 weeks
1 time per day for the next 2 weeks
1 time per month thereafter

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:02 am

jlp8cornell wrote:
Brown wax could be yeast, which is easily tested for by your vet. Yeast infection is pretty much always a secondary problem, with either allergies or constant swimming underlying. If he's not itchy, probably not allergy. Make sure you flush ears at the end of each swimming day; my favorite is EpiOtic. Add 50% white vinegar to suppress yeast growth. Don't use Balsimic; he might start barking in Italian. Also, mineral oil before flush if wax is heavy.

It is mainly in his left ear. He had a bad infection as a pup in that ear. Is it possible he built up some scar tissue that may be causing some of the problem? His right ear is normal.

My personal opinion is that swimming has little to do with yeast infections because persistent infections tend to be in one ear. They right books about this problem, but many people have long-term success with probiotics and higher protein foods.

kumate · Post by **kumate** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:10 am

That is the protocol i used, he had alot of brown non odorous wax and head shaking going on. He swims in the swimming pool daily now i use it after every swim and it is keeping it in check although if i didnt i think they would get gunked up again. He is pretty itchy so it is hard to say the cause could be environmental. I am using abady MS and his overall coat is good shines great energy etc. Problem is he is scratching alot and licking at his ankes and both thighs leaves brown stains on his white hair their. As soon as this box is finnished i am going to try Orijen 6 fish and see what happens

Jerry

Chaingang · Post by **Chaingang** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:15 am

kumate wrote:That is the protocol i used, he had alot of brown non odorous wax and head shaking going on. He swims in the swimming pool daily now i use it after every swim and it is keeping it in check although if i didnt i think they would get gunked up again. He is pretty itchy so it is hard to say the cause could be environmental. I am using abady MS and his overall coat is good shines great energy etc. Problem is he is scratching alot and licking at his ankes and both thighs leaves brown stains on his white hair their. As soon as this box is finnished i am going to try Orijen 6 fish and see what happens

Jerry

The fact that he is scratching and licking sure sounds like allergies. Any possibility it could be related to chemicals in the pool??

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:40 am

We use 1/2 isopropyl alcohol, 1/2 white vinegar and then dilute with some glycerine to help with sting and drying. I use it to wash the boys' ears out after they swim.

Spray in, massage it around, wipe the ear out with a paper towel.

Works wonders.

Greg J.

jlp8cornell · Post by **jlp8cornell** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 9:42 am

I try the purple wash for a bit and see what happens. Trying to scarf up the ingredients from some of the labs here.

He never shakes his head, scratches, etc. We will see how this works. I am also going to swab it and have a friend look at it under a scope.

thanks for all the help.....

kumate · Post by **kumate** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 10:30 am

It very well could be the pool chems, I am going to start rinsing him off real good after swimmimg

Jerry

birddog1968 · Post by **birddog1968** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 12:04 pm

Seems to me the bottle I buy from the vet of medicated ear wash is easier and cheaper, if your time accounts for anything.

For 25 bucks I can keep all 4 of my dogs ears clean as a whistle with no mixing and having multiple ingredients......

jmho.

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 12:29 pm

birddog1968 wrote:Seems to me the bottle I buy from the vet of medicated ear wash is easier and cheaper, if your time accounts for anything.

For 25 bucks I can keep all 4 of my dogs ears clean as a whistle with no mixing and having multiple ingredients......

jmho.

That's what I though when someone told me about it when my lab's ears were a mess but its so cheap:

Gentian Violet: $2.99
Boric Acid: $3.00
Witch Hazel: $2.00 times 3 years

$11.99, for a boat load (3 years) of the stuff. I still have plenty of the Violet and Boric Acid left.

birddog1968 · Post by **birddog1968** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 1:05 pm

I got ya,we have violet here at the kennel, but I'm stickin with my medicated ear wash...
Grab the bottle, no fuss.....works for me

jlp8cornell · Post by **jlp8cornell** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 1:42 pm

I just bought the stuff from the pharmacy. Cost under $10 and will last forever. Mix it once and you have the same thing essentially as a pre-made in 1 min.

Now to see if Max and I turn purple.........

jcbjr · Post by **jcbjr** » Mon Jul 19, 2010 10:15 pm

jlp8cornell wrote:
Brown wax could be yeast, which is easily tested for by your vet. Yeast infection is pretty much always a secondary problem, with either allergies or constant swimming underlying. If he's not itchy, probably not allergy. Make sure you flush ears at the end of each swimming day; my favorite is EpiOtic. Add 50% white vinegar to suppress yeast growth. Don't use Balsimic; he might start barking in Italian. Also, mineral oil before flush if wax is heavy.

It is mainly in his left ear. He had a bad infection as a pup in that ear. Is it possible he built up some scar tissue that may be causing some of the problem? His right ear is normal.

unilateral infections are common, and sometimes hard to explain. Scarring or polyp formation can certainly make the ear more susceptible to infection. I can validate many cases of otitis externa that were caused or exacerbated by swimming ( is it the water, or the crud in the water, some of which is allergenic?), but I think allergies underly most, which again raises the question "why just one ear?". Have you had the ear looked at with an otoscope? When one of my patients has a troublesome, persistent ear infection I often put them under anesthesia and thoroughly explore and clean the ear canal. I often find polyps deep in the canal that aren't visible otherwise, even sometimes chronic, non healing ruptured eardrums, even congenital stenotic [narrowed] ear canals. Some forum members suggested nutritional (hypoallergenic diets, top quality foods or raw protocols)/probiotic treatment, which might help, too. Most likely allergies are food and atopy, the later of which is allergy to particulate allergens (pollen, house dust, mold, etc.). allergic dogs often manifest itching in other places, such as lower legs and feet, flanks, abdomen, chest, arm pits. Flea allergies mostly affect the top of the dog, from about mid back to tail, and backs of thighs, but don't usually affect ears. diagnosing/ treating underlying allergy, if any, and frequent flushing, are the foundational treatments. Topical antifungals/antibacterials help, but until you get at the cause, it's all just temporary. I allergy test many chronic ear dogs, and almost always get positive tests. A cortisone shot or course of prednisone tablets is the poor mans diagnosis of the presence of allergy, especially if dog is itchy in multiple spots; if itching stops, you're probably dealing w/ allergy. I, just as most vets. do not advocate chronic use of "cortisone" drugs, but they are helpful short term and for the above use. Remember, yeast is an opportunist, not really a primary pathogen; some problem must exist for the little buggers to multiply and become a problem themselves. Itchy, irritated ears produce much more wax than normal ears, which serves as a growth medium for yeast; add in trauma from scratching, and the little bugs get dug in deep and start to cause a problem. Just some food for thought.

God luck!......................Jim B., DVM

Chaingang · Post by **Chaingang** » Tue Jul 20, 2010 12:10 am

jlp8cornell wrote:I just bought the stuff from the pharmacy. Cost under $10 and will last forever. Mix it once and you have the same thing essentially as a pre-made in 1 min.

Now to see if Max and I turn purple.........

Just make sure to shake the whole concoction well prior to each use

jlp8cornell · Post by **jlp8cornell** » Tue Jul 20, 2010 5:43 am

chaingang: yes, will shake every time....

JimB: There is no smell, no itching, no redness/irritation......He just always has wax buildup in the left ear. I doubt he has any allergies. He eats Orijen, gets supps, looks amazing- no coat issues and also the other ear is not infected.

My guess it is is a "structural" problem. His primary care vet has never mentioned an issue but....I will ask one of my friends to bring an otoscope home with him tonight and look at it. Thanks....

kumate · Post by **kumate** » Tue Jul 20, 2010 7:40 am

Jim, i wanted to take a minute to thank you for volunteering your exerience and expertise for myself and others on this forum. I might not always respond to a thread but i am always listening

Jerry Walker

kumate · Post by **kumate** » Tue Jul 20, 2010 7:45 am

Jb8 after i am finnished with this box of Abady i am going to try the orijen and see if it cuts down on his lower exremety licking. Do you use the 6 fish? How many cups a day do you use? how long does a 30 lb bag last you

Thanks Jerry

jlp8cornell · Post by **jlp8cornell** » Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:43 am

after i am finnished with this box of Abady i am going to try the orijen and see if it cuts down on his lower exremety licking. Do you use the 6 fish? How many cups a day do you use? how long does a 30 lb bag last you

Thanks Jerry

I use Orijen Adult, not fish. Yikes, feeding that to 2 dogs would be pricey.

I can get the adult for $54 but Fish is $65. From what I have heard, those prices are really good and $10-15 less then average

Max is a 60# GSP (intact 2 yr old male) and he eats ~4 cups total each day. If I run/swim him for over 3 hours, I up it and give him a third meal as he is scrawny. Chloe is a 85# hound mix spayed 12 yr old female and she eats 3c/day. I can't tell you how long the bag lasts because I also cook for them and supplement their diet that way. I would say for one dog the bag would last ~1 month.

What kind of dog do you have? Are you considering switching foods just to switch protein sources? I thought you were concerned that the pool chems when causing the allergies......

kumate · Post by **kumate** » Tue Jul 20, 2010 9:31 am

Yes, i currently feed abady and can get the 6 fish for 63 local. It very well may be the pool chems just dont know. I cannot keep him out of the pool. I am going to rinse him good after being in the pool and switch to just fish as the protein source
He is a small 2yr 50lb Gsp
Jerry

jlp8cornell · Post by **jlp8cornell** » Tue Jul 20, 2010 9:34 am

I would think a bag would last you well over a month then.....

SubMariner · Post by **SubMariner** » Wed Jul 21, 2010 6:55 am

jlp8cornell wrote:What does anyone use to keep their dogs ears clean and dry,........Max swims 5+ days/week. I do not want to use alcohol based cleaners that much. Any ideas?

Thx..... (Max has a lot of of wax build-up and I clean his ears regularly).

What we scuba divers use after diving in fresh water:

1/3 white vinegar to 2/3 isopropyl alcohol. (A few drops in each ear after diving will help evaporate the water--which sets the stage for the bacteria and fungi.) The alcohol can be somewhat irritating, so you might want to substitute hydrogrn peroxide.

The big thing is to keep the ph balanced while getting rid of any fresh water nasties.

Bossman27 · Post by **Bossman27** » Tue Jul 27, 2010 11:57 am

Any suggestions on where I can find Boric Acid Powder? Do I have a pharmacist order it?

jlp8cornell · Post by **jlp8cornell** » Tue Jul 27, 2010 12:05 pm

Any suggestions on where I can find Boric Acid Powder? Do I have a pharmacist order it?

I got it at Rite Aid. If not on the shelf, ask the pharmacist to order.

jen

mcbosco · Post by **mcbosco** » Tue Jul 27, 2010 12:05 pm

Any pharmacy has that. Even the supermarket might have it in the meds aisle.

Just dont buy Boric Acid meant for pests like a feed or hardware store might have.