Ol Roy High Pro ?????

TimSchoenborn · Post by **TimSchoenborn** » Mon May 26, 2008 11:59 am

Hey guys......

I did a search and really did not find any answers for this question I have. I fed Pro Plan for a long time but have become frustrated with the very large price increase here locally in Michigan. I gave Diamond a try and have noticed much larger and a little looser stools. I am not unhappy with it but not happy either.

I live by a WalMart and was looking at the" Hi Pro Ol Roy" and was hoping to get some insight on who has used it, or using it and some feedback.

Price is amazing but it is not all about money. It sure is easy for me to get food though logistically.

Thanks in advance

Tim Schoenborn

www.timschoenborn.com

Post by **ezzy333** » Mon May 26, 2008 12:16 pm

You will get a hundred people telling you how bad it is and I agree it sure isn't the best feed made ut it is not terrible either. If your dog isn't being worked extremely hard it will work. I looked at their feed a few weeks ago and they had a lamb and rice Ole Roy I believe that looked pretty good. However be aware you can't tell much from the ingredient list except what is in the feed and truthfully Ole Roy today is probably better than anything was fed 40 and fifty uears ago and the dogs then performed about like they do today. Check the price and make up your mind what to try and then watch your dog. He is the one that will tell you how good it is.

If you have a Sam's close by their Exceed is pretty darn good. About the same feed as Pro-Plan.

Ezzy

big steve46 · Post by **big steve46** » Mon May 26, 2008 1:07 pm

Many years ago, I fed Ol'Roy Hi Pro for a few years. When I switched to Diamond Premium, I found that it lasted about 50% longer with better stools. Which Diamond have you been using?

TimSchoenborn · Post by **TimSchoenborn** » Mon May 26, 2008 1:16 pm

Thanks guys........

Been feeding the Diamond "Hi Energy" Good prices on it here at the feed store. I have always fed Pro Plan. I don't like keeping the dogs on Performance when the summer sets in either. I am of the belief it is tough on them when they don't burn it off. I have also been considering trying the Neutrena Loyall line but I have not gone to check it out yet. I have a feeling that is going to be on the pricey side also.

It is really not a money issue as it seems like pet shops here around me are closing up and I am tired of driving all over to get food.............

big steve46 · Post by **big steve46** » Mon May 26, 2008 1:39 pm

Tim, You should try a bag of Diamond Premium. It is a step up from the HiEnergy, but not as hot a food as the Performance. There is less chance of stool problems with the Premium.

romeo212000 · Post by **romeo212000** » Mon May 26, 2008 3:30 pm

I have heard of a lot of people having loose stools with the hi-energy. The Premium is an excellent option. Its what I feed my dog. A friend of mine feeds his labs Ol Roy hi performance and their coats look bad and their stools are very loose. I dont usually dog a particular food but Ol Roy is not your best bang for your buck.

Big Dave · Post by **Big Dave** » Mon May 26, 2008 4:26 pm

Diamond premium and Ol Roy hi pro run about the same in cost around here. I had better stools and much better hair with my dogs on the premium Diamond than the hi energy Diamond.

TimSchoenborn · Post by **TimSchoenborn** » Mon May 26, 2008 6:39 pm

Thanks guys I will give the Premium a shot. I appreciate all your input. It was just what I was looking for........

Tim

Rick Hall · Post by **Rick Hall** » Tue May 27, 2008 5:59 am

If another Diamond formula doesn't help, remember what Ezzy said about Sam's Exceed...

big steve46 · Post by **big steve46** » Tue May 27, 2008 9:46 am

Although some may disagree, the source of corn in D. Premium is better than the one in HiE. Exceed looks like a good formula, but I wouldn't say it's any better than D. Premium. I assume the Exceed costs less than 45 cents a pound; otherwise, it would be silly to pay more.

Rick Hall · Post by **Rick Hall** » Tue May 27, 2008 10:05 am

There's more to value than cost.

MarineX · Post by **MarineX** » Tue May 27, 2008 10:13 am

TimSchoenborn wrote:I gave Diamond a try and have noticed much larger and a little looser stools. I am not unhappy with it but not happy either.

Don't imagine you are happy, the issue is you are degrading your dog food. With each change you're getting worse and worse in your choices. Just review the ingredients and see the trend for yourself. Then once looking at that, notice how there isn't a quality ingredient in those kibbles. That's why your dissatisfied!

romeo212000 · Post by **romeo212000** » Tue May 27, 2008 12:33 pm

I disagree. I find Diamond's formula to be better then many foods that cost more. Diamond Premium has ground whole corn which contrary to popular myth is actually good for the dog and not just a filler. There is a difference between corn meal and ground whole corn. Ground whole corn provides fats and oils that are good for a dog. Corn meal is a filler. And it is a far better formula than Ol Roy.

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Tue May 27, 2008 1:00 pm

For what it's worth, my older dog had BM issues with the Diamond Hi Energy, but did not with some Diamond Exteme Athlete that I tried.

Regards,

Greg J.

KY Grouse Hunter · Post by **KY Grouse Hunter** » Tue May 27, 2008 2:00 pm

What about SportMix? Have any of you tried any of those brand formulas? I have used the Hi Energy and had pretty good luck with it.

http://www.sportmix.com/index.tpl

big steve46 · Post by **big steve46** » Tue May 27, 2008 2:52 pm

If value of two products is the same, why pay more than you have to? By the way, after reading a recent post about half way thru without having noticed the author, I figured it was marine, and sure enough, I was correct! In answer to another question, I have never fed Sportsmix, but having reviewed the formula and ingredients, it appears to be a good feed. Again, most working dogs do well on most of what most of us consider good feeds, but occas. certain animals will have special needs such as less sensitive ingredient feeds, or even may need to be fed part of their diet with raw foods. Most of the times however, the commercial feeds such as Diamond, Black Gold, Sportsmix, Nutrena, Purina, and others do very well. If you want to eradicate chemicals and go all natural and spend over a dollar a pound, more power to you, but I'll take my chances with most of the 26-18 formulas or so.

Maurice · Post by **Maurice** » Tue May 27, 2008 2:58 pm

KY Grouse Hunter wrote:What about SportMix? Have any of you tried any of those brand formulas? I have used the Hi Energy and had pretty good luck with it.

http://www.sportmix.com/index.tpl

I have fed tons of the sportmix Hi-Energy formula.. It does a good job, the dogs run good and hold thier weight... Diamond is way over priced around here for some reason, Green bag is 23.50 and suppose to go up again, some of the small feed stores are dropping it. BlackGold is priced about 1.00 higher than Diamond, it is getting dropped too by some of the stores.. The Exceed 30/20 food from Sam's is fairly popular.. I just hate to go to Sam's and fight the crowd to get it. Sam's also sells a Hi-Pro food that is thier brand.. It is 17.00 for 50 lbs. don't think it is the same as Old Roy Hi-Pro but I could be wrong about that. I have fed some of the Sam's member mark Hi pro and it is pretty good summertime food. You would be surprised who feeds this food. I know some big bird dog kennels that feed it year around.. I also know of some vet boarding kennels that feed this food but sell Science Diet. All you can really do it feed something that works for your dog and forget about all the hype that goes with the dog food business... When I 1st started in the dog training business 25 years ago the best food in this area was Joy Special Meal or Purina Hi Pro.. Both feeds would be considered cheap low end feeds today.. The dogs did just fine on either feed, all the bird dog and coonhound folks fed 1 or the other it seemed like.. Pet food industry is driven by slick ads and hype IMO.. I don't normally post in the dog food threads, probably should have stayed silent this time

Mo

TimSchoenborn · Post by **TimSchoenborn** » Tue May 27, 2008 5:01 pm

Wow lot's of answers here guys I appreciate it........

I have been in the dog game for a real long time also I should mention. I think we have reached a point where there are a lot of foods that are just a flat out ripoff to be honest. I watch my dogs pretty close and pay attention to coat and stools and even eye clarity. I always have had good success with Pro Plan but they are really proud of the product and it shows at the register here as of late.

I was able to get Diamond Premium today for $19.00 for a 40# bag. I hope it works out as that is a good value. I should also add it is not about the money with me either rather just paying to much for a product. I feel the same way when I pull up to the diesel pump here lately. Makes me sick.

Thanks again guys I will let you know how it works for me.

MarineX · Post by **MarineX** » Tue May 27, 2008 5:18 pm

People, what you feed your dogs, if you really get right down to it, basically defines what they have the potential to become…just about as surely as do the dogs genetics. Yet when most people shop for dog food, the last thing on their mind is; “is this the best I can do for my dog to help him reach his full potential?” Instead, what is usually on an owner’s mind is when shopping for dog food is “How can I spend as little as possible?” That’s not how it should be! Just look at all the time and money you spent on the dog, training, training equipment, hunting and training supplies, etc. Yet you want to skimp on a vital part of the equation-nutrition? Not sure any member on this board would buy a NASCAR and then skimp on the fuel putting 87% octane gas in it thinking it would work just like the more expensive high-octane leaded fuel designed for that performance car. Yet don’t think twice about doing it with their performance driven canine. Once you start seeing quality nutrition as an “investment” (just like that bloodline on that dog that warranted the price tag), as opposed to an “expense” the more you’ll take a look at the side label on the feed you’re feeding and begin to ask yourself if that is the best you can do for your canine athlete…or if you’re slowly killing your dog with that poison.
Unlike what Big Steve has stated it doesn’t cost a $1 per lb to feed a quality kibble. In fact in another thread I clearly compared two brands and shown it’s actually cheaper per pound to feed the “premium” dog food versus the lesser brand. But let’s pretend Big Steve was right in it costing that much…is that really a lot? Can you even go to the grocery store and buy the cheapest nastiest ground beef for a $1 per lb? I don’t think so! There is a reason those large dog food manufacturers fill the shelves up with numerous brand of dog food. It’s to keep you as a customer, if feeding one of their brands and your dog does poorly; they know you’ll grab the next one over next trip. Continuing that cycle until you finally stumble across one your dog can moderately tolerate, but if reviewing the ingredients it’s still poor quality all down the line.
Seems some disagree with my statement on Tim degrading his dog food choices. So let’s look at it and see for ourselves. He started out with Pro Plan (unsure which kind) but was unhappy with the price.
First 10 ingredients of Pro Plan”
(As I stated; “unsure which kind he used” so I’ll just pick the Chicken and Rice for comparison)

Chicken, brewers rice, whole grain wheat, poultry by-product meal (natural source of glucosamine), corn gluten meal, whole grain corn, animal fat preserved with mixed-tocopherols (form of Vitamin E), corn bran, fish meal (natural source of glucosamine), animal digest

First 10 ingredients of Diamond Premium:

Chicken by-product meal, whole grain ground corn, wheat flour, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), brewers rice, beet pulp, egg product, flaxseed, natural chicken flavor, fish meal

First 10 ingredients of Ol Roy High Performance:

Ground yellow corn, meat and bone meal, corn gluten meal, soybean meal, wheat middlings, animal fat (preserved with BHA and citric acid), chicken by-product meal, rice, animal digest, salt

Now in reviewing these ingredients we can clearly see a clear degrade in the ingredients. I wasn’t making something up, it’s clear the ingredients are on a downward spiral if looking at them. While Pro Plan isn’t remotely a quality dog food, it is still better than the other two. At least with Pro Plan you got one quality meat source. All in all, all three of those brands are severely lacking and should be avoided! Each is filled with poor quality ingredients that are extremely hard for a canine to digest, and hold little nutritional value. All three of the brands above have the pesticide Ethoxyquin in them and Ol Roy has the added carcinogen BHA in it. Those dog foods are designed to maximize the companies profit-not fuel your athlete!

Post by **slistoe** » Tue May 27, 2008 5:37 pm

MarineX wrote:People, what you feed your dogs, if you really get right down to it, basically defines what they have the potential to become…just about as surely as do the dogs genetics........All in all, all three of those brands are severely lacking and should be avoided! Each is filled with poor quality ingredients that are extremely hard for a canine to digest, and hold little nutritional value.....Those dog foods are designed to maximize the companies profit-not fuel your athlete!

MarineX, could I get a wee smattering of the trials you have attended where your dogs, which have maximized their potential, have run those deprived dogs on these poor foods into the ground?

TimSchoenborn · Post by **TimSchoenborn** » Tue May 27, 2008 5:43 pm

I am not so sold on the term degrading by Canine standards.

There are a lot of valid points being brought up on this thread. I make a living in the equine industry around a very large amount of animals that are worth 7 figures. There are the same issues when it comes to feeding horse's. I have also back a few years ago gone for the more natural and holistic types of food and found that I had more stool issues with the stuff that is more designed for human consumption than a canine are too rich for dogs on more than one occasion. I feel a lot of these designer dog foods today are pure hype. Remember we are talking about a dog not a human here.

Yes they have to be fed well and need plenty of workouts and also time to recover but really how much better does a dog do on one food vs another most of the time really depends on the dog. Like it was mentioned earlier in this thread I have seen some National Champion dogs that ate Purina Hi Pro there entire lives and were made up of nothing but muscle and bone and could run all day.

I have quite a few friends who are Vets and they are somewhat split on all of this too. Most of them say the same thing. There are a lot of good foods and a lot of way overpriced foods these days with dogs.

This debate will go on and on I imagine in regards to dog foods. Along the way some companies are going to get very wealthy selling a lot of food that in a lot of cases is what I believe to be overkill.

The healthiest horse's that I see are fed grain and hay daily. It always seems like the ones on a more exotic diet are the ones who have issues...................

Makes you stop and think sometimes.

dugger13 · Post by **dugger13** » Tue May 27, 2008 6:46 pm

Each is filled with poor quality ingredients that are extremely hard for a canine to digest, and hold little nutritional value.

I am wondering if you can tell me what ingredients to look for. It seems i always hear what NOT to look for, but not really WHAT to look for. How about a real life example of a feed that you use. So we can compare.

Post by **Sharon** » Tue May 27, 2008 9:01 pm

I would consider this dog food to have the necessary ingredients in the correct percentages for an active dog, but I could be wrong.

Calories 3,706 kcal/kg, 426 kcal/cup

Ingredients Chicken, Corn Meal, Ground Whole Grain Sorghum, Chicken By-Product Meal, Chicken Fat (preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of Vitamin E), Dried Beet Pulp, Chicken Flavor, Chicken Meal, Potassium Chloride, Dried Egg Product, Brewers Dried Yeast, Salt, Flax Meal, Fish Oil (preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of Vitamin E), Caramel, Calcium Carbonate, Choline Chloride, Minerals (Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Oxide, Manganese Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Manganous Oxide, Potassium Iodide, Cobalt Carbonate), Vitamins (Vitamin E Supplement, Ascorbic Acid, Vitamin A Acetate, Calcium Pantothenate, Biotin, Thiamine Mononitrate (source of vitamin B1), Vitamin B12 Supplement, Niacin, Riboflavin Supplement (source of vitamin B2), Inositol, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (source of vitamin B6), Vitamin D3 Supplement, Folic Acid), DL-Methionine, Rosemary Extract.

Guaranteed Analysis Nutrient (percent)
Crude Protein, minimum 26.0
Crude Fat, minimum 15.0
Crude Fiber, maximum 4.0
Moisture, maximum 10.0
Omega-6 Fatty Acids, minimum 2.5*
Omega-3 Fatty Acids, minimum 0.25*

big steve46 · Post by **big steve46** » Tue May 27, 2008 9:31 pm

Looks good to me, as long as the dog processes it well.

Killer Instinct · Post by **Killer Instinct** » Tue May 27, 2008 10:16 pm

big steve46 wrote:Tim, You should try a bag of Diamond Premium. It is a step up from the HiEnergy, but not as hot a food as the Performance. There is less chance of stool problems with the Premium.

Hey Steve - what do you mean by "hot"? (consider me a newbie in dog food jargon

)

Thanks!

romeo212000 · Post by **romeo212000** » Tue May 27, 2008 10:30 pm

Not as much fat and protein content.

I am getting really tired of people who dont seem to get that dogs do not have the same nutritional requirements we as people do. A lot of that "High Quality" dog food is too rich and overkill. I would agree with whoever challenged the gentleman who was stating Diamond and Pro Plan was low quality to show me solid proof where his dogs or any other dogs that were being fed "High Quality" food ran the ccompetition completely in to the ground. Otherwise I will assume it is simply someone trying to make himself feel better about spendiing a ton of money on his food by making others feel they are feeding subpar food. Or I will assume you are blowing smoke.

Post by **Sharon** » Wed May 28, 2008 6:04 am

Any guesses on the name of the dog food I posted the ingredients/percentages for?

dugger13 · Post by **dugger13** » Wed May 28, 2008 6:59 am

Any guesses on the name of the dog food I posted the ingredients/percentages for?

i have no clue, but this should be a fun game to watch now. Thank god i am slow at work today.

I am getting really tired of people who dont seem to get that dogs do not have the same nutritional requirements we as people do. A lot of that "High Quality" dog food is too rich and overkill. I would agree with whoever challenged the gentleman who was stating Diamond and Pro Plan was low quality to show me solid proof where his dogs or any other dogs that were being fed "High Quality" food ran the ccompetition completely in to the ground. Otherwise I will assume it is simply someone trying to make himself feel better about spendiing a ton of money on his food by making others feel they are feeding subpar food. Or I will assume you are blowing smoke.

I would have to agree with most of what you said. But their seems to be some really bad food out there according to people on here (pretty much anything at Walmart is bad apparently). And there seems to be some very high end food as well. Pro-plan being the top or near the top of the list.

big steve46 · Post by **big steve46** » Wed May 28, 2008 7:27 am

killer, " hot " refers to readily usable calories being high. High fat of 20% or more is usually defining as fat has 9 calories per gram whereas protein and carbos has 4. Someone else may have a sl different definition. My expertise is in human nutrition not canine, but obviously most rules apply to both. I do believe that animals, even in the commercial lines, are fed better because the nutritional content is not processed out in animal food. So, since most good brands that have good formulas and ingredients seem to do the job well, I find them acceptable. Our dogs are already eating better than we are nutitionally, so we don't need to be paranoid nitpickers about our animal's food.

Post by **ezzy333** » Wed May 28, 2008 8:01 am

It could be any of probably a thousand feeds. Thank God the nutritionist for the dog food companies follow the same guidelines that have been well researched and not what gets posted in some forum. That list of ingredients that everyone reads is there to tell you what is being used and a clue as to how much. But that list could be completely different and the feed still provide the same nutrition. People who think they can judge a feed by the list of ingredients are fooling themselves. At best, it just gives you a clue. It's the same with calories per cup, since it is influenced by the processing method as well as calories per lb. and tells you very little.

Thank God we don't worry so much about what our kids eat or that debate would never end instead of just being a monthly occurance. And the people who feed animals for a living seem to understand what the animals need and they all get fed about alike without constant debate. And it seems it is the owner with one or two dogs or horses that have the continuing problems instead of the more experienced people who watch their animals and determine the quality of the food instead of reading the bag.

Oh well, just my thoughts,

Ezzy

Post by **Sharon** » Wed May 28, 2008 1:32 pm

Wow. Sorry if I upset you. I just thought it might be a little fun. I'll crawl back into my inexperienced hole now.

Post by **ezzy333** » Wed May 28, 2008 1:47 pm

Sharon,

No one is upset with you. I just answered your question and then made a few comments about the posts on this thread and the many other threads we have had just like this one. My comments were for the people who think they caqn tell the quality of a feed by looking at the ingredient list.

I liked your idea and think it would be interesting for everyone to list the first ten ingredients and see who can guess what feed it is.

Ezzy

Post by **Sharon** » Wed May 28, 2008 2:04 pm

Thank you. I'm new so I'm not tired of dog food discussions yet.

Sounds like I will be at some point.
Hopefully everyone knows that "the proof is in the pudding" and the pudding is the dog.

My now deceased father was very poor. He had a beagle. Every Friday afternoon he used to meet the truck that went to the construction sites and get the left over meat pies that hadn't been sold. This is what he fed his dog.
I know the dog got protein, carbs and fat. No idea of the percents. That dog always looked great, had lots of energy and kept my Dad in rabbits for supper. He lived to 15. Definately not recommending this diet , but maybe we've made life way too complicated.

Post by **ezzy333** » Wed May 28, 2008 2:29 pm

I think you are exactly right. Too many people have too much time and become too educated by reading too many things written by people who know too little.

Ezzy

Killer Instinct · Post by **Killer Instinct** » Wed May 28, 2008 5:13 pm

big steve46 wrote:killer, " hot " refers to readily usable calories being high. High fat of 20% or more is usually defining as fat has 9 calories per gram whereas protein and carbos has 4. Someone else may have a sl different definition. My expertise is in human nutrition not canine, but obviously most rules apply to both. I do believe that animals, even in the commercial lines, are fed better because the nutritional content is not processed out in animal food. So, since most good brands that have good formulas and ingredients seem to do the job well, I find them acceptable. Our dogs are already eating better than we are nutitionally, so we don't need to be paranoid nitpickers about our animal's food.

Thanks Steve & romeo212000

Big Dave · Post by **Big Dave** » Wed May 28, 2008 7:55 pm

Sharon,
I am stumped! What dog food did you list the ingredients for? The grain sorghum is something I don't usually see. Look forward to the answer.

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Thu May 29, 2008 5:49 am

Sharon wrote:I would consider this dog food to have the necessary ingredients in the correct percentages for an active dog, but I could be wrong.

Calories 3,706 kcal/kg, 426 kcal/cup

Ingredients Chicken, Corn Meal, Ground Whole Grain Sorghum, Chicken By-Product Meal, Chicken Fat (preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of Vitamin E), Dried Beet Pulp, Chicken Flavor, Chicken Meal, Potassium Chloride, Dried Egg Product, Brewers Dried Yeast, Salt, Flax Meal, Fish Oil (preserved with mixed Tocopherols, a source of Vitamin E), Caramel, Calcium Carbonate, Choline Chloride, Minerals (Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Oxide, Manganese Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Manganous Oxide, Potassium Iodide, Cobalt Carbonate), Vitamins (Vitamin E Supplement, Ascorbic Acid, Vitamin A Acetate, Calcium Pantothenate, Biotin, Thiamine Mononitrate (source of vitamin B1), Vitamin B12 Supplement, Niacin, Riboflavin Supplement (source of vitamin B2), Inositol, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (source of vitamin B6), Vitamin D3 Supplement, Folic Acid), DL-Methionine, Rosemary Extract.

Guaranteed Analysis Nutrient (percent)
Crude Protein, minimum 26.0
Crude Fat, minimum 15.0
Crude Fiber, maximum 4.0
Moisture, maximum 10.0
Omega-6 Fatty Acids, minimum 2.5*
Omega-3 Fatty Acids, minimum 0.25*

I know that both Science Diet and Eukanuba use the ground sorghum...

Post by **Sharon** » Thu May 29, 2008 6:15 am

I'll post the winning answer on Friday. The winner gets a free ticket to the eighth game of the Stanley Cup.

SFK · Post by **SFK** » Thu May 29, 2008 7:22 am

Iams Pro Active Health.

Hope the cup finals goes to game 8!!

MikeB · Post by **MikeB** » Thu May 29, 2008 8:49 am

You beat me to it...I agree, It's Iams chunk/mini chunk formula.

Post by **Sharon** » Thu May 29, 2008 11:21 am

Yes it is, Your ticket is is the mail Not what i feed but the only food I could find that you could cut and paste, Well done Gentlemen.

big steve46 · Post by **big steve46** » Thu May 29, 2008 2:48 pm

MikeB is correct. I thought everyone knew that! By the way, I just picked up a 50# sack of Diamond Premium at my feedstore today and paid $21.18 tax included. The IAMS costs almost twice as much per pound. The IAMS is a very good quality, but not worth twice as much!

Post by **Greg Jennings** » Fri May 30, 2008 6:48 am

big steve46 wrote:MikeB is correct. I thought everyone knew that! By the way, I just picked up a 50# sack of Diamond Premium at my feedstore today and paid $21.18 tax included. The IAMS costs almost twice as much per pound. The IAMS is a very good quality, but not worth twice as much!

Regular IAMS over $42? Wow. While I don't feed it, I don't remember it being anywhere near that expensive here.

I know that cost is a big deal for many folks. I don't like to waste money, but at our house, strangely enough, once past how well the dog generally does on it, the stool/BM is absolutely the biggest issue. I never have enough hours in the day to do what I want to do. I constantly have to prioritize where I'm going to spend the few precious hours over and above work. I can't afford to spend it on a constipated or runny dog or on difficult clean up.

Greg J.

big steve46 · Post by **big steve46** » Fri May 30, 2008 7:47 am

Tax included, The IAMS would have have been almost $32 for 40 lbs.. That makes it almost .80 per lb.. I like their formula, but I don't like it enough to pay that price.

Post by **ezzy333** » Fri May 30, 2008 8:11 am

We need to keep the facts straight guys. We do not know what their formula is as well as anyone elses. Formulas are private and protected. What we do know is the list of the ingredients used in the formula. There is a big big difference!. And a big difference in trying to judge a feed. I can give you a list of ingredients for a cake and you would still have no idea of the formula to make it. Remember formula is just another word for recipe. It includes the ingredients needed, the amount of each, the mixing instructions, and any other instructions needed to manufacture the product.

What are calling a formula is nothingmore than a list of ingredients and you sure can't tell very much about a feed from that. As far as price goes the test of how much a food is worth is how well your dog is doing on it, how much you need to feed, and not what order the ingredients are listed in or how much a pound it costs.

Ezzy

big steve46 · Post by **big steve46** » Fri May 30, 2008 8:36 am

I've always said it's important how well the dog processes the feed. List of ingredients and costs do have relevance to a lot of people. At least, it's something to discuss and compare. Of course, it's important to be able to have faith in the company that they are using good formulating procedures. I don't think it should be confusing to use the terms formula and ingredients the same, but if it bothers the "purists ", perhaps we can be a little more differentiating.

Post by **ezzy333** » Fri May 30, 2008 8:52 am

Thank you Steve. Never been called a purist before. My reputation tends to lean to the other side. Can I tell people I am a Puritan now?

Ezzy

big steve46 · Post by **big steve46** » Fri May 30, 2008 9:11 am

Ha Ha, I'm glad to see you have a sense of humor! By the way, I picked up a sample bag of Loyall yesterday. They have a different type of processing supposedly. I might start a new thread later on it for variety sake. Gotta leave, will look for response tonight.