Modifying vintage guns

[muddycreek]

Would I be absolutely crazy to have my grandpas old model 12 bored out from full to an improved mod? I love the gun, but the full choke leaves a little to be desired especially when a covey o' quail get up. It is a really fun, light gun to hunt with but i don't carry it much due to the full choke. I guess I don't plan on ever selling it so I guess I can probably answer my own question.

Any negatives outside of the reduced value?

[BigShooter]

Another option is to check Numrich or another online used gun parts seller. They may have a used Model 12 barrel in a more open choke or buy a used full barrel & have the second barrel bored out if you want to keep the gun original. There are so many used Model 12s out there that I really wonder if it is so prized as a collectible that changing the choke will alter the value but you could always contact a used gun dealer and ask an expert. Personally I shoot imp cyl for pointed phez until late in the year.

[Dave Quindt]

I guess the question you have to answer is "do I want a heirloom that's unaltered but will sit in the safe or do I want an heirloom that's slightly altered (but not visible) but is usable and can be enjoyed in the field?"

If this is a post WWII standard grade 12 gauge in anything less than very good condition, the gun isn't really an overly valuable gun anyway, due to the sheer number of guns in that configuration and condition available. A higher grade gun, especially one in pristine condition and/or a pre-war gun might be a different story.

If you want to know the age and approx value of your gun post your question on the forum linked below; just be sure to read the first topic in the forum about how to ask these sorts of questions:
http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewfor ... 61801880bf

You do have some other options. There are a number of spreader loads out there that work with a varying degree of effectiveness. They all work; the problem is some result in patchy patterns. Some guns will like some loads and give you great patterns; other guns will give you lousy patterns with the same load.

I've had a good deal of luck using Fiocchi's Power Spreader load in #8 shot. Below are pattern photos showing this load shot from a Beretta BL-4 12 gauge with a full choke at 20 yards. Any gun shot catering to clay shooters should either carry this load or be able to get it. I find them in the $6-10/box range when sold retail. 7.5 shot is available; I've not been lucky in finding any at the shop I usually buy from. AbleAmmo has them for $8 via their website.

Polywad makes a spreader load as well. A bit more expensive but the expansion is less aggressive than the Fiocchi load, so they may fit your needs better depending on the range you expect to be shooting at. I've used their spreader loads with #6 shot for pheasants with good success.

http://www.polywad.com/spredr-shells.html

So there are some options you have if you want to occasionally use gramp's gun but are not quite ready to open the choke.

FYI,
Dave


Here's the Beretta full choke at 20 yards with a standard Remington game club load:



Same gun at 20 yards using Fiocchi Power Spreader load:

[Pryor Creek Okie]

I think you would be better off opening that choke up to Imp Cyl for quail hunting. Imp Mod is almost as tight as Full.

[tommyboy72]

Or maybe even skeet depending on how well you shoot and how close the shots are. In my SXS and O/U 20's I usually use Skeet and IC till later in the season and I go to IC and MOD.

[muddycreek]

thanks for the input. I decided I am going to open it up and use it rather than just look at it. SInce I pheasant hunt almost exclusively I am leaning towards the Imp Mod. I love quail hunting, but with the low numbers I treat them as more of an incidental bonus, not the primary target. I don't mind taking a bird or two out of the covey's on the land I hunt, but I like seeing em more than killing them.

[BigShooter]

I hope you're just mixing up terms because imp mod is the next step down from full. There is so little change from Full to imp mod that in my opinion it'd be a waste of time & money & I doubt like heck you will be able to notice the difference. I don't even use mod on pheasants until very late in the year. I suggest you read this article before going ahead: http://www.wildfowlmag.com/tips_strateg ... un_062304/

[Pryor Creek Okie]

I hope you're just mixing up terms because imp mod is the next step down from full. There is so little change from Full to imp mod that in my opinion it'd be a waste of time & money & I doubt like heck you will be able to notice the difference.

That's was the point I was trying to make.

[muddycreek]

Guilty as charged I really want between improved and modified, i.e a light modified.

[BigShooter]

We were just trying to be helpful and wanted to be sure you were going to use the right terms with the gunsmith so you get the desired result.

[Gordon Guy]

Oops... I saw someone already mentioned spreader loads I recommend RST shotshells http://www.rstshells.com/rst_classic_sh ... shells.htm


Post deleted

[shanebevel@gmail.com]

I know this is a few weeks old. But if you haven't sent it to the smith yet, I would really really suggest you give the PolyWad or RST loads a try. They will be easier on your gun, quality loads and will keep you from hacking into an heirloom. I have a 1920s double (Lefever Nitro) that I recently bought and was looking at doing the same thing. BUT I gave the loads a try and found they work awesome. They don't cost that much more than a quality shell and I can still shoot non-spreader loads and keep the full/mod chokes for dove or trap.

Anyhow, just another vote for the specialty loads.

Shane

[highcotton]

[quote="Dave Quindt"]I guess the question you have to answer is "do I want a heirloom that's unaltered but will sit in the safe or do I want an heirloom that's slightly altered (but not visible) but is usable and can be enjoyed in the field?"

If this is a post WWII standard grade 12 gauge in anything less than very good condition, the gun isn't really an overly valuable gun anyway, due to the sheer number of guns in that configuration and condition available. A higher grade gun, especially one in pristine condition and/or a pre-war gun might be a different story.

If you want to know the age and approx value of your gun post your question on the forum linked below; just be sure to read the first topic in the forum about how to ask these sorts of questions:
http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewfor ... 61801880bf

You do have some other options. There are a number of spreader loads out there that work with a varying degree of effectiveness. They all work; the problem is some result in patchy patterns. Some guns will like some loads and give you great patterns; other guns will give you lousy patterns with the same load.

I've had a good deal of luck using Fiocchi's Power Spreader load in #8 shot. Below are pattern photos showing this load shot from a Beretta BL-4 12 gauge with a full choke at 20 yards. Any gun shot catering to clay shooters should either carry this load or be able to get it. I find them in the $6-10/box range when sold retail. 7.5 shot is available; I've not been lucky in finding any at the shop I usually buy from. AbleAmmo has them for $8 via their website.

Polywad makes a spreader load as well. A bit more expensive but the expansion is less aggressive than the Fiocchi load, so they may fit your needs better depending on the range you expect to be shooting at. I've used their spreader loads with #6 shot for pheasants with good success.

http://www.polywad.com/spredr-shells.html

So there are some options you have if you want to occasionally use gramp's gun but are not quite ready to open the choke.

FYI,
Dave



Dave,

I have a gun bored SK and SK that does not pattern well with anything I have tried. Is it possible that spreader loads could improve the pattern in such a gun that already has open chokes?

Charles

[tdhusker]

I'm definitely in the "use it and enjoy it" camp. The thing isn't worth as much as a new autoloader anyway so you might as well enjoy it. There isn't another pump that could compare to a model 12 and they make a dandy pheasant gun. I'd open the choke and have some fun.