Gun Dog Forum

I’m expecting to get my first bird dog, a French Brittany, in late September. I’ve read a lot about the importance of GPS collars and can see why they’re seen as such a great thing. However, I’m wondering how necessary they are, especially for a dog that’s not expected to range all that far. The dog will hunt gambel’s quail 99% of the time, in country I know like the back of my hand. I’m wondering if a bell or beeper would be enough to be comfortable. I’m sure it will come down to personal preference but I would like to hear your opinions.

Opinions vary, but I don't think anyone would describe it as "necessary," especially for a close ranging dog. I have hunted quite a bit with some top-flight bird dogs of two different breeds, including a FC and one that was halfway to a FC. Beeper always worked fine with me. But for those who claim they don't care for the sound, there are varying sounds you can program it to produce and you can easily set it to "point only" mode or even "locate only" mode. I do think a beeper is preferable to a bell, as you can hear it further and there's a lot to be said for hunting silently (locate only). Beep every five or 10 seconds also has merit under some circumstances. And... beepers are very easy to use and not terribly expensive.

With a GPS collar you will probably never run the risk of losing your dog. They are especially helpful in heavy cover or if you have a big running dog. For you, hunting in AZ with a dog that doesn't range out several hundred yards you probably don't need a GPS collar. And I would totally rule out a bell. You generally see bells being used more in the grouse woods where it's difficult to see a dog in dense cover. And I'm not so sure in your situation that you would even benefit from a beeper collar. I ran beepers here in South Dakota before I went to a GPS collar. I ran the beeper in "point only mode" so that I could find my dogs when they went on point. I think in your case I would buy a good e-collar and whistle train my dog. You certainly could get by without a GPS, beeper or bell.

A gps is just good insurance and good for your peace of mind. I do hunt big country with big running dogs so I would not be without one. So go with your gut and do what works for you.

I view the GPS collar as necessary as my shotgun or ecollar. Yes you can run a dog without one, but why?

Even a close ranging dog gets lost. Chases a rabbit, takes a wrong turn, burrows in deep on point and is tough for you to find them.

A GPS collar is an insurance plan. I'm not sure how I could walk through my front door and have to explain to my wife or child why the dog didn't return home that evening.

I don't think you need one right away but if you saved $5 a day you could buy an Astro 430 in 4 or 5 months. Saving $5/day now is better than a lost dog later.

I agree 100% with the previous tow posts. A GPS is like buying an insurance policy so that you won't lose your dog.

I've hunted lots of open and brushy habitats, never used a GPS and never lost a bird dog. So I don't think a GPS is necessary.

fishvik wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 04, 2022 5:09 pm

I've hunted lots of open and brushy habitats, never used a GPS and never lost a bird dog. So I don't think a GPS is necessary.

I've never lost a dog either and don't plan to start now. That's why I run a GPS collar on my dog. If you ever do lose a dog, even if it's for a short time, your opinion might change. It's a terrible feeling.

fishvik wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 04, 2022 5:09 pm

I've hunted lots of open and brushy habitats, never used a GPS and never lost a bird dog. So I don't think a GPS is necessary.

Noone thinks they need one until they do.

Then the sun is going down, you haven't seen your dog in an hour or 2 and now your best hope is leaving your jacket on the ground, only to return the next morning hoping your dog is curled up on your coat.

You really don't realize how much ground a dog can cover and how quickly they do it until you have GPS or telemetry. In my case it's GPS and in that situation I know where my dog is, or I throw my long range roof antenna on my truck and I have my dog back.

I would be if you asked every person that invested in a GPS unit for their dog, 99% would say they wouldn't regret purchasing one and it has improved the quality of their hunt.

I used a bell on close working Brittanys. Cant tell you how many times I was cussing that dog. Where the heck is she. Frustration. I hunt on the Mojave desert also. I got a big running Brittany and broke down and bought a Garmin 430. Would never be without one again. so much more satisfying hunts. you may consider looking for an older used model Garmin. My 430 is only track so my dog also runs a e collar also.

Dakotazeb wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 04, 2022 8:08 am

I think in your case I would buy a good e-collar and whistle train my dog.

Just want to clarify…does this mean train the dog to come when I blow a whistle and then have the e collar there as backup? ie if the dog doesn’t respond then give it a little shock?

Ryan DooLittle you make a good point about not having to get one right away but save up for one before our first season. Realistically I won’t be able to hunt the dog much if at all this year since it’ll only be 7 months old by the end of our season (that statement leads me to a bunch of other questions that I’ll be asking you guys in the coming weeks haha)

Oldbeek I tried to respond to your private message but couldn’t because my account on here isn’t old enough. I’ll make some more posts today and message you back as soon as I’m allowed to.

azquailguy wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 05, 2022 7:27 am

Dakotazeb wrote: ↑

Mon Jul 04, 2022 8:08 am

I think in your case I would buy a good e-collar and whistle train my dog.

Just want to clarify…does this mean train the dog to come when I blow a whistle and then have the e collar there as backup? ie if the dog doesn’t respond then give it a little shock?

That's basically what I'm saying. But before you start shocking the dog for not responding to the whistle the dog needs to be trained to come to the whistle. Once he learns what the whistle means and then doesn't respond you can give him a little shock to re-enforce the whistle. Just like teaching him the "Come" command, etc.

azquailguy wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 05, 2022 7:41 am

Ryan DooLittle you make a good point about not having to get one right away but save up for one before our first season. Realistically I won’t be able to hunt the dog much if at all this year since it’ll only be 7 months old by the end of our season (that statement leads me to a bunch of other questions that I’ll be asking you guys in the coming weeks haha)

I hunted my shorthair at about 5 months old. Pretty low pressure, we did the ground work in September to get her exposed to the gun and in mid October we were shooting pheasants over her.

I wouldn't rush your puppy but if you start laying in the ground work I don't think there is any reason you couldn't hunt your dog this fall at 7 months old. Keep it light, keep it fun, and worry more about the dog having a good day vs shooting birds. I bet it isn't long until you are shooting quail over your new dog.

RyanDoolittle wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 05, 2022 6:13 pm

azquailguy wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 05, 2022 7:41 am

Ryan DooLittle you make a good point about not having to get one right away but save up for one before our first season. Realistically I won’t be able to hunt the dog much if at all this year since it’ll only be 7 months old by the end of our season (that statement leads me to a bunch of other questions that I’ll be asking you guys in the coming weeks haha)

I hunted my shorthair at about 5 months old. Pretty low pressure, we did the ground work in September to get her exposed to the gun and in mid October we were shooting pheasants over her.

I wouldn't rush your puppy but if you start laying in the ground work I don't think there is any reason you couldn't hunt your dog this fall at 7 months old. Keep it light, keep it fun, and worry more about the dog having a good day vs shooting birds. I bet it isn't long until you are shooting quail over your new dog.

This was really encouraging. I know it’ll depend on my individual dog but I really hope I can hunt over it a little this year. Definitely don’t want to rush things too much and have a setback. Thanks for the comment.

In my estimation, besides the obvious, “I won’t be leaving my coat and hoping my dog makes it back tomorrow” aspect of the GPS collar. The most important thing a GPS does for a dog owned by someone new to bird dogs, is teaches the handler to trust the dog and leave them be to hunt. The buttons on a training collar seem to be pushed a whole lot more without trust and without a gps, even if a dog is where they should be. Out of site and finding birds to the front of you. Dogs are much better at locating us, than we are them.

Garrison

When I got my dog a GPS/training collar combo, peace of mind finally entered the picture.

I went a lot of years without a GPS collar, never could afford one. Then I got Bodie and Squirt and suddenly I had no clue where the dogs I took with me were. Spent the money on a GPS and always knew about where they were after that! After Bodie and Squirt I got Stormy and he doesn't run anything at all like my outlaws did, pretty much always know where he is. But I've had him in awfully close, like well under 50 yds and have not been able to spot him in heavy or dense cover; GPS collar fixed it right up! I do not let any of my bird dogs lose now without a GPS collar on them, call it peace of mind! Stormy generally hunt's within 300 yds of me and I like that. But once in a while he'll get out about 600yds and I know where he is, good thing to know! if you can afford one, it's money well spent!

No it is not necessary. I hunted for decades without one. It is however in my estimation the best tool developed for a bird hunter in my lifetime. Although not necessary I would advise anyone that asks advice to purchase one if they can afford it. I don’t look at it a lot but at times have found a GPS collar extremely useful when a dog does not check back in and I’m in dense cover or big country.

A GPS collar is not necessary until you can't find your dog , and then you wish you'd bought one.

Sharon wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:54 am

A GPS collar is not necessary until you can't find your dog , and then you wish you'd bought one.

It's like trying to find your way around a new town or city. Sure you could pull out the paper map, or just open your cellphone and it will guide you exactly where you want to go

RyanDoolittle wrote: ↑

Thu Jul 14, 2022 9:36 pm

Sharon wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 13, 2022 6:54 am

A GPS collar is not necessary until you can't find your dog , and then you wish you'd bought one.

It's like trying to find your way around a new town or city. Sure you could pull out the paper map, or just open your cellphone and it will guide you exactly where you want to go

My world was pretty small back then, was the Thomas Guide in your vehicles too? (1967 VW Bug). Hate to try and find a dog with one.

What if the dog runs away? Chases a deer? Goes after a bird or rabbit? You may not NEED one, but for me, it's the cheapest insurance I can buy. There's also YOU. I hunt a lot of big woods and with a GPS, I can get out.

gonehuntin' wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 12:18 pm

What if the dog runs away? Chases a deer? Goes after a bird or rabbit? You may not NEED one, but for me, it's the cheapest insurance I can buy. There's also YOU. I hunt a lot of big woods and with a GPS, I can get out.

Or with the addition of Inreach, someone can get in to get you out.

RyanDoolittle wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 4:01 pm

gonehuntin' wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 12:18 pm

What if the dog runs away? Chases a deer? Goes after a bird or rabbit? You may not NEED one, but for me, it's the cheapest insurance I can buy. There's also YOU. I hunt a lot of big woods and with a GPS, I can get out.

Or with the addition of Inreach, someone can get in to get you out.

If you just say "Home, Lassie! Home!", your dog will go for help. I have seen it many times on television.

Steve007 wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 7:06 pm

RyanDoolittle wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 4:01 pm

gonehuntin' wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 12:18 pm

What if the dog runs away? Chases a deer? Goes after a bird or rabbit? You may not NEED one, but for me, it's the cheapest insurance I can buy. There's also YOU. I hunt a lot of big woods and with a GPS, I can get out.

Or with the addition of Inreach, someone can get in to get you out.

If you just say "Home, Lassie! Home!", your dog will go for help. I have seen it many times on television.

RyanDoolittle wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 4:01 pm

gonehuntin' wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 12:18 pm

What if the dog runs away? Chases a deer? Goes after a bird or rabbit? You may not NEED one, but for me, it's the cheapest insurance I can buy. There's also YOU. I hunt a lot of big woods and with a GPS, I can get out.

Or with the addition of Inreach, someone can get in to get you out.

Yes! Although, knock on wood I haven’t needed it for that. The Inreach has worked out really nicely to text in reinforcements when we needed to get an animal packed out of a tough canyon or when needing to communicate with the family while out at sea or in the hills.

Garrison

Garrison wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 9:42 pm

RyanDoolittle wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 4:01 pm

gonehuntin' wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 12:18 pm

What if the dog runs away? Chases a deer? Goes after a bird or rabbit? You may not NEED one, but for me, it's the cheapest insurance I can buy. There's also YOU. I hunt a lot of big woods and with a GPS, I can get out.

Or with the addition of Inreach, someone can get in to get you out.

Yes! Although, knock on wood I haven’t needed it for that. The Inreach has worked out really nicely to text in reinforcements when we needed to get an animal packed out of a tough canyon or when needing to communicate with the family while out at sea or in the hills.

Garrison

You have good friends. If I got a text elk hunting saying they needed help getting an elk out of a canyon, I'd say the canyon walls blocked the signal!

gonehuntin' wrote: ↑

Wed Jul 20, 2022 1:07 pm

Garrison wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 9:42 pm

RyanDoolittle wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 4:01 pm

Or with the addition of Inreach, someone can get in to get you out.

Yes! Although, knock on wood I haven’t needed it for that. The Inreach has worked out really nicely to text in reinforcements when we needed to get an animal packed out of a tough canyon or when needing to communicate with the family while out at sea or in the hills.

Garrison

You have good friends. If I got a text elk hunting saying they needed help getting an elk out of a canyon, I'd say the canyon walls blocked the signal!

gonehuntin' wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 19, 2022 12:18 pm

What if the dog runs away? Chases a deer? Goes after a bird or rabbit? You may not NEED one, but for me, it's the cheapest insurance I can buy. There's also YOU. I hunt a lot of big woods and with a GPS, I can get out.

There's a good point no one made. Hunt in a place where your not sure how to get back and my garmin 320 will allow me to back trail myself. Discovered that by accident one time while out with Bodie. Works like a champ!

AZ -

I am a little late to this discusion, but here's my 2 cents.

I agree that you should not need a GPS collar right away. A French Britt "TYPICALLY" is a fairly close working dog breed and a youngster"TYPICALLY" will want to stay close to its hunting partner until it gains confidence.

I am not a fan of bells for two reasons. First the bell is ringing all the time and the louder the bell, the more it can affect the dog's hearing over time. Second, when the dog is not moving, the bell is not making any noise. So if the dog stops moving, for ANY reason, the bell is no help finding them.

I used Lovett's top mounted beepers for many years(before GPS was available) and found that I could keep track of the dog out to about 400 yards in light cover on a reasonably still(not windy) day. Interestingly, when I was hunting or training a pair of dogs, they could hear each other from significantly greater distances. The top mounted speaker is also much more kind to the dog's ears, since the sound is directed up and away from them. Also the beepers that are low on the neck give different response depending on whichwaythe dog is headed. if the dog is headed away from you, the sound is blocked by the dog's chest.

By the end of the dog's first year, you should be able to make a much better evaluation of your need for additional location equipment. I would encourage you to consider spending the money on a good GPS system, if for no other reason than peace of mind. As has been said... cheap insurance.

RayG

PS - I hunted with big going pointing dogs long before there were things like beepers or GPS. There was always a little knot in the pit of my gut when I cut a dog loose, because you never knew(for absolute certain) if you were going to see that dog again. In over sixty years of chasing big going dogs,i ain't lost one permanently(YET), but there have been quite a few times when a dog was gone for a few hours and a handful of times(when chasing deer, etc) when, after a sleepless night, I found the dog laying on my coat the next morning. A good GPS can eliminate pretty much all of that for most hunters.

Am I the only one that thinks the most important time to have a GPS is when the dog is very young?

I recently upgraded to a inreach equipped Alpha 200i. If anyone needs a very high condition (2) TT-10 collars Alpha 100 system, drop me a PM. All new batteries, original boxes and accessories.

roaniecowpony wrote: ↑

Thu Jan 05, 2023 3:28 am

Am I the only one that thinks the most important time to have a GPS is when the dog is very young?

I recently upgraded to a inreach equipped Alpha 200i. If anyone needs a very high condition (2) TT-10 collars Alpha 100 system, drop me a PM. All new batteries, original boxes and accessories.

I agree, that derby age it's tough to keep track of them. They have the run of an adult dog and the handling of a puppy. If you got one with some power, they will tire a good horse out. But boy are they fun!

Yes, for me they are always on my dogs when I turn them loose.