Bells and Beepers When Hunting

gar-dog · Post by **gar-dog** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 9:26 am

This season will be my first time hunting grouse in the Northeast woods over my own dog. I have a TriTronics collar with a beeper. Frankly it is a bit of a buzz-kill to have that thing on all the time. I have thought about using a bell on the dog, and then remotely turning on the beeper if she is out of site for awhile or I get nervous. Sooooo... how many of you use bells, and do you like them, etc. Any recommendations?

romeo212000 · Post by **romeo212000** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 9:58 am

It depends a lot on the dog. My buddy tried a bell on his dog and it drove her absolutely nuts to the point where she basically forgot about hunting.

dugger13 · Post by **dugger13** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:49 am

What about a beeper in silent (point only) mode. Keep the collar on all the time then.

Plus
On most beeper collars you can always hit a locate button and find the dog.

That is how i run my dogs up here in wisconsin. But the beepers never go off here because we have no birds.

PntrRookie · Post by **PntrRookie** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 12:34 pm

Bell and beeper on point mode only. The bell is nice to listen to and the beeper does not affect the birds. I use my in the hawk screech mode. Get a nice durable bell that won't get ripped off the collar in the brush.

PAHunter · Post by **PAHunter** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 7:26 pm

I run my dog with the beeper in point mode only for grouse. I hunt as quiet as I can when grouse hunting I don't yell at my dog, I don't use whistles ( to call my dog I use the tone button on the G2). Grouse are jumpy enough, with out all the racket. I have a buddy thats had lots of dogs come up hard of hearing from bell, plus its harder for a dog to hear commands when be got a loud bell in his ear. Also for what its worth I think the tritonics beeper is a piece of junk. On point mode only it starts going off then my dogs slows down to a walk. Now I got the new sport dog model and the problems solved. So, If you like all the noise go ahead run the bell, run the bepper, blow the whistle, yell at your dog, talk to your buddies, and when you don't see any grouse, just don't blame your dog. Happy hunting!!

dugger13 · Post by **dugger13** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 8:34 pm

i couldn't agree more.
I hunt with duct tape on my mouth, and beepers in point only mode. And i still flush and bump many a bird.

Scott Linden · Post by **Scott Linden** » Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:01 pm

My vote is for quiet, too.

I wrote a TV feature a while back about "zipping it," in all respects. Shut up. Walk softly. Take the jingle-jangles off the collar. Put the whistle away for the most part. If you aren't able to hear your dog while hunting the deepest woods maybe a little bell but otherwise, smell (listen to?) the roses, so to speak.

gar-dog · Post by **gar-dog** » Thu Aug 14, 2008 7:02 am

Thanks guys. I am just scared of losing my dog - this is my first bird dog. I only want the beeper on as a last resort. I don't even want it on in "point only' mode frankly. The solitude of the hunting experience is what I am into. That's why I wondered if just a little tinker might be helpful. Maybe I just need to knuckle up and get a tracking collar to put my mind at ease.

PntrRookie · Post by **PntrRookie** » Thu Aug 14, 2008 7:14 am

PAHunter wrote:I have a buddy thats had lots of dogs come up hard of hearing from bell...

I would bet the deafness is not coming from the bell. If it is "lots of dogs" as you say, it may be the breeding. Or better yet, age. If it is from the bell, you would be seeing companies pulling bells, beepers off their shelves and not selling them. Or you would see the anti-hunting dog people all over that. Tough for me to swallow that one.

Bells are a great way to keep track of your pup. Especially if you do not like the beeper. If you want to walk slow, tip-toe through the woods and have your dog close enough that you do not loose them...hunt with a flushing dog. Once your pup has figured out a grouse, you should not want them that close to you, let them get out there and find the birds...let them roll! JMHO

bwjohn · Post by **bwjohn** » Thu Aug 14, 2008 11:15 am

I enjoy hearing my dog run through the wood with the bell. And what is even more exciting is when you do not hear the Bell!

Brandon

birdhunt · Post by **birdhunt** » Sat Aug 16, 2008 7:49 pm

EXCITING??...........WHEN I DON'T HEAR MY BOYKIN'S BELL IT MEANS SHE IS TAKING A DUMP!!

Rick Hall · Post by **Rick Hall** » Sun Aug 17, 2008 6:31 am

Despite my current home at the edge of the Gulf coastal marsh, this is a topic of interest to me, as I ordered my life around ruffed grouse hunting for a number of years - enough so that there were eight straight when I seldom missed an open season day in the grouse woods, unless on a road trip for something else. Most of my hunting then was in Appalachian hill country, as is what little grousing I still get to enjoy, and may not be applicable to another's situation.

But a pointing dog that stayed so close we could get by without a bell or beeper would serve as little more than company on my hunts. By employing a good dogless hunter's tactics, I'd put up the great majority of the birds such a dog might locate.

Though I started with a fine representative of the oft-heralded close working grouse dog, experience taught me the value of dogs that "worked to the edge of the bell" - and a big, loud bell at that. But through association over time, the sound of that bell took on all the sweet essences of Autumn and grousing, and I'd have been hard pressed to name something that pleased my ear more. Except its sudden silence:

Fast forwarding through a change of venue and some years of waterfowl guiding, however, found me with gun-shot hearing that could no longer follow the tone of even a large bell at the ranges I wanted my, then mostly quail, dogs to work. And a beeper I found about as pleasing as the sound of a backing-garbage-truck became mandatory. I initially hated it, perhaps in large part, due to that very association. But, over time, I became so acclimated to the beep that it readily blended into the whole of a hunt.

Now here's the funny thing. I, to this day, hate the appearance of any collar on a dog but especially those with boxes and speakers attached, so I occasionally dig my beloved bell out of retirement and replace the beeper with it for photographic purposes - and I find that once sweet instrument's constant clanging absolutely grating. Hate it! Simply because time apart has stolen its association with the hunt.

As for how the birds feel about beepers, I might argue that the beeper's steady beat actually helps lull them into sticking tight, but that would be hard to prove. Can, however, say with certainty that experience has shown that a little Louisiana quail dog wearing a beeper on both run and point mode will have no trouble sticking grouse in hard hunted public coverts come February.

natetnc · Post by **natetnc** » Sun Aug 17, 2008 8:44 am

i am not a big fan of the constant loud beeping but for some reason i keep mine on run/point mode. i may try point only this season now that my dog has went a full season on run/point. i feel it is important to condition them to the beeper before doing point only, this way if they have a problem with the beeper it will not be related to bird activity, i wanted my dog to pay absolutely no attention to the beeper, consider it a part of the hunt. i have never had the beeper spook birds that i know of but i do know it spooks the deer making that less of an issue to deal with.

mudhunter · Post by **mudhunter** » Mon Aug 18, 2008 7:31 pm

I have a hard time invisioning hunting grouse with a good ranging pointing dog without a bell as others have stated. I hunted them with a lab for a time and no bell was neccary but I would be clueless as to where my setter was if it didn't have a bell or beeper on. The grouse cover I hunt will swallow a dog up in 20 yards. I couldn't agree more with no yelling at the dog. A good grouse dog needs to get away from the hunters and the hunter must trust the dog! But first he has to know where the dog is!

phermes1 · Post by **phermes1** » Mon Aug 18, 2008 8:10 pm

I've only been grouse hunting once, and my dog handles very well, so take it for what it's worth ... but I would have had a helluva time keeping track of him without a bell. I didn't find the bell all that distracting. Do what ya gotta do, but bottom line - give yourself a way to find your dog.

If you want absolute quiet, and you've got $600 laying around doing nothing, check into the Garmin Astro.

gar-dog · Post by **gar-dog** » Mon Aug 18, 2008 8:35 pm

phermes1 wrote: If you want absolute quiet, and you've got $600 laying around doing nothing, check into the Garmin Astro.

I think I am at that place right now. As a new bird dog owner, I don't want to ruin the experience with constant anxiety over losing my dog. I think I will probably use a small bell but knuckle down and by the Garmin Astro. I was about to buy a new Garmin handheld as it is - so another couple hundred gets me the tracking collar too.

nj gsp · Post by **nj gsp** » Mon Aug 18, 2008 9:07 pm

I usually use a small bell just to keep track of my dog. I put electrical tape on the rim of the bell so it goes clank instead of ding. Then the clapper fell out, so it was just bell clanking against license tag and rabies tag. It came off on my last hunt, and I wasn't planning on replacing it, but I don't know. More than anything else, a bell is not so much for me to know where my dog is, it's for other hunters to know where my dog is.

I just got a G2 Upland, and plan to use the beeper to locate only.

I thought about getting an Astro too, but only because I'm curious as to how far my dog runs during a hunt. However, I'm not curious enough to fork out $600.

gar-dog · Post by **gar-dog** » Tue Aug 19, 2008 6:16 am

nj gsp wrote: However, I'm not curious enough to fork out $600.

If you do some homework online, you can get these for $450. I was about to shell out $300 for a Garmin GPS handheld - so for an extra $150 it's not a bad trade.

KY Grouse Hunter · Post by **KY Grouse Hunter** » Tue Aug 19, 2008 6:47 am

Personally, I like a bell (not a turkey bell but a bigger one) and a beeper. I like a remote controlled beeper to run on point-only mode, and I like a bell for tracking the dog, and plus the bell is old school which is cool. I hunt the mountains of south appalachia so bells and beepers are almost necessary.

natetnc · Post by **natetnc** » Tue Aug 19, 2008 6:48 am

gar-dog wrote:
nj gsp wrote: However, I'm not curious enough to fork out $600.
If you do some homework online, you can get these for $450. I was about to shell out $300 for a Garmin GPS handheld - so for an extra $150 it's not a bad trade.

i think they are talking about the new model

gar-dog · Post by **gar-dog** » Tue Aug 19, 2008 8:00 am

A GDF member offers a member discount for the new models, and he will have them at the end of the week.

NE Vizsla · Post by **NE Vizsla** » Tue Aug 19, 2008 8:46 pm

phermes1 wrote:I've only been grouse hunting once, and my dog handles very well, so take it for what it's worth ... but I would have had a helluva time keeping track of him without a bell. I didn't find the bell all that distracting. Do what ya gotta do, but bottom line - give yourself a way to find your dog.

If you want absolute quiet, and you've got $600 laying around doing nothing, check into the Garmin Astro.

note..the bell in your picture.

phermes1 · Post by **phermes1** » Wed Aug 20, 2008 4:42 am

NE Vizsla wrote:
phermes1 wrote:I've only been grouse hunting once, and my dog handles very well, so take it for what it's worth ... but I would have had a helluva time keeping track of him without a bell. I didn't find the bell all that distracting. Do what ya gotta do, but bottom line - give yourself a way to find your dog.

If you want absolute quiet, and you've got $600 laying around doing nothing, check into the Garmin Astro.
note..the bell in your picture.

Yep - didn't have $600 laying around!!!

Ruffshooter · Post by **Ruffshooter** » Thu Aug 21, 2008 7:54 am

I Like the bell on my dogs. They in grouse cover only get out maybe a 100 yards or so, so usually I can hear them and not when they stop (huh go figure). I have one GSP that I need to use the beeper (Point only mode) Can not stand listening to that thing all the time, I do not use a bell with her because I do not need to know where she is until go time. I can not stand that screech sound, I bought a Dogtra (I think beeper) The First time I turned it on I was leaning back in the kitchen charir and that @#%#@*** screech was on. I knocked me right over.

I use Lion country's heavy duty brass bell. And use the Cabelas Beeper only. On the beeper I put a small piece of tape on it to tone it down abit.

Like what I got and how it works.

gonehuntin' · Post by **gonehuntin'** » Mon Sep 01, 2008 10:42 am

I hate bells. A dog goes deaf from a bell faster than a beeper, if the beeper is run in point-only-mode.

A bell quits when you need it the most.

Put an orange vest on the dog too unless it's white; they're tough to find even when they "beep".

wchua24 · Post by **wchua24** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 9:37 am

well you should train your dog to have a bell..at first he wont be comfortable and it will drive him crazy...

fuess · Post by **fuess** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 8:58 pm

G-Dog

Swiis bell with a wrap of electrical tape around it to soften it a bit, with a beeper on point only. The bell keeps me in touch where the dog is moving and the beeper lets me know where the dog is.

Works nicely in my world.

GOod luck!

Have you talked to Pete lately? Tell him I said hello.

FUess

gar-dog · Post by **gar-dog** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 7:15 am

For our first time in strage woods in October, I will take a belts and suspenders approach...

I bought a Swiss Bell, will have the beeper on the collar, but will only turn it on remotely if necessary, and get a Garmin Astro. If I lose the dog then, I will give up hunting foreever.

Fuess: have chatted some with Pete but missed my training opportunity this summer - he was full. Then when he could take her this month, she went into heat.

The Zephyr · Post by **The Zephyr** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 7:26 am

I run my dogs with a bell and beeper in point only mode. No hawk screeches or anything. This year however I'll be utilizing a tracking collar as well for peace of mind.

John L.

ymepointer · Post by **ymepointer** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 9:58 am

I use a small bell. It would be almost impossible to find my pointer in the early season without this bell. I don't like the hawk scream mode on the beeper collars but if I had the money I would probably use a combo bell and beeper in point mode. You can just see the bell on this point if you look close. It is not big but I can faintly hear it at I would say 100 yards in heavy cover with no major wind. If it is windy it is very hard to hear at 50 yards.

fuess · Post by **fuess** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 4:18 pm

G-DOg

tried to get Macduff in for a kennel and training session myself, while on vacation and Pete was full as well. Glad to see he is that busy.

In any case, hope to get up there for a visit this month. May just stop by and say hello. I am lucky enough I am only about 45 minutes from the traing faciclity.

ALl the best,

Fuess

birdhunt · Post by **birdhunt** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 6:42 pm

I USE A BELL ON MY BOYKIN, AS I DID WITH MY LABS.............JUST HATE IT WHEN I LOOK FOR THAT BEEPER ON ONE OF THOSE POINTING DOGS AND IT IS JUST TAKING A SH1T!

claybuster_aa · Post by **claybuster_aa** » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:41 pm

gar-dog wrote:This season will be my first time hunting grouse in the Northeast woods over my own dog. I have a TriTronics collar with a beeper. Frankly it is a bit of a buzz-kill to have that thing on all the time. I have thought about using a bell on the dog, and then remotely turning on the beeper if she is out of site for awhile or I get nervous. Sooooo... how many of you use bells, and do you like them, etc. Any recommendations?

gar-dog, I have the same setup, a TriTronics w/beeper and it's a pretty good setup, Sport 65 is the name. I got mine about 6 years ago. Zoe chewed the antenna when pup, but not too bad so I wrapped with some electrical tape. I eventually ordered a new antenna, and got a fresh battery last year. I hunted her without the beeper for a while but up until last season, we started going with the beeper. A bell is a must IMO, at least around here and probably where you are, there are usually other hunters in the area.

Go with a bell all the time, and before you know it your dog is going to associate a few things with hunting. The bell, the orange, the gun, the collar, and your dog will be the first one waiting at the truck for you.

When using the beeper which I like now, I go without the bell and set to double-beep run tone. In point tone I set it to point and not hawk scream. I also set the volume low. Even with low volume, it is fairly loud, so I put a piece of tape over the end. A cotton ball and tape will also work well to keep it mild, and you will still be able to easily hear the tones. I try to always keep her in sight, but some areas are hilly, and the beeper has alerted me more than one occasion, she's on a bird
but just out of sight.

RayGubernat · Post by **RayGubernat** » Thu Sep 18, 2008 8:15 pm

gar-dog -

I started hunting over big running pointers long before there were beepers or trackers or GPS's.

We would cut the dogs loose and then go find them on point. If the dog didn't find and point a bird, it would come back around in ten minutes or so to touch base.

In all the years from then till now(45+), I have never lost a dog permanently. A couple took off on deer but in each case I got them back the next morning because they came back..all on their own to a shirt that I laid outwhere we had been parked. Each was laying on the shirt when I drove up.

My point is this... If a dog likes you and wants to be with you...it will. If it likes you and wants to hunt with you, it will come back for you. It really is just that simple. The converse is also true. If the dog does not like you or want to be with you, all the elctronics in the world won't keep the dog with you. It will find a way to get gone.

When I cut a dog loose and watch it fade out of sight, I still get a knot in the pit of my stomach...I won't lie to you about that. It still scares me a little. However, I know in my heart that the dog knows where I am, pretty much all of the time and when he feels the need, he will look me up because he likes me and wants to be with me. I made sure of that when he was a pup.

It is not at all uncommon for a first time bird dog owner to be VERY uncomfortable with watching their pride and joy head out of sight. Trust the dog...trust the bond you have created. You won't be disappointed.

Some folks think I am a nut case for leting my dogs range as far and wide as I do sometimes. I dunno , maybe I am.

I do know this however...

If you never let your dog out of your sight, never let it go over that hill, never have that knot in the pit of your stomach, you will never know the absolute joy and pride(and relief) that washes over you when you top that hill and find your boy on the back side...locked up tight as a tick...just standing there, eyeball to eyeball with a bird... waiting for YOU.

It don't get a whole lot better than that. But you can't know tht feeling if you don't let them go over that hill.

Trust your dog, trust your training, trust the bond that you have developed with the dog. it will pay off. The Garmin Astro is a great tool and if you can afford it, it offers an excellent margin of safety. But know this...when the bell gets packed with snow and the batteries run out on the electronics...the bond that exists between you and your dog will pull him back to you, sure as the sun will rise.

RayG

The Zephyr · Post by **The Zephyr** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 8:01 am

Ray,

Great response.

Two years ago I released my youngest charge, Natasha, with my friend’s equally young (or younger) setter, Cody, on a desolate logging road in the grouse woods. We watched as the cloud of puppies and gravel dust disappeared over a small rise. As the time went on I became more and more anxious but my hunting partner assured me “If she’s really your dog, she’ll come back. You just have to give her a chance.” It could have been five or ten minutes, it seemed like an hour, but from behind the knoll I had seen her last, came a powdery wisp rising like a streamer. Natasha broke the hill first followed closely by Cody.
I’m not sure who was more elated on their return, the dogs or their owners.

Thanks for refreshing my memory.

John L.

gar-dog · Post by **gar-dog** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 9:54 am

Ray,
Comforting post. One thing for certain is that Ginger and I are well-bonded. In our training grounds she always checks in, often busting out of cover where all I see is the tops of grass moving and then just brushing against my leg and then off in another direction. (I think it's curious that she does that, brushing my leg as she goes by). But I am much more comfortable at the club, where I have "home court" advantage.
Cheers,
Gary

nj gsp · Post by **nj gsp** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:21 am

my dog loves me, but she has attention deficit disorder. She sometimes goes off doing her own thing and forgets I'm along. That's why I bought a beeper.

You can get lost intentionally on a pup, and after a minute they start looking for you. But Igot my dog at an older age, and as I said she loves me, but we never bonded from puppyhood.

tdhusker · Post by **tdhusker** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 3:34 pm

Living where we hunt near county roads, state highways, combines in the corn, windrowers in the millet, trains on the track, I want a good loud beeper. I can't let the dogs get close to a busy road. Last season one of my hunting partners lost a very good Brittany when hunting in tall cover near a county road. A semi with a loaded grain trailer came along at just the right time and splat! No more pride and joy.

When I am within range of danger and don't have sight of my dog, I give a locate beep for peace of mind. Also when hunting that buffalo grass in SD, the stationary mode is priceless. That stuff holds birds tight and guys without beepers spend a lot fo time looking for their dog on point. Personally, I would not consider anything but a beeper collar on a pointing dog anymore.

gonehuntin' · Post by **gonehuntin'** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 4:47 am

One more thing on bells and beepers. First, grouse hunting, if you just cut a dog loose, no beeper and that dog goes on point 100-200 yards out, there is no way you will ever find that dog. A lot of the stuff here in Wi. we hunt grouse in is so dense, you can't see a dog 50 feet away.

Next, in Mi. or Wi., remember the Wolves. A bell seems to apparently either attract wolves or alert the wolf that the dog is in it's territory and the animal becomes more susceptible to Wolf attack. That's another reason I like keeping my dogs within 100 yards of me, to help prevent Wolf attack. Apparently, though there is not a lot of info to back this up, the Wolf don't home in on a beeper like they do a bell.

whitedogone · Post by **whitedogone** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 6:18 am

If you were to hunt with a Astro, you would never want to be without one again! Does it have it's faults? ... sure. But, it changed the way I hunt and hunting is much more stressfree. In the cover I hunt a bell or beeper is only good for 50-75 yards in the wind. That meant I knew where my dogs was for about 30 seconds after she crapped after being let out of the truck. I can watch the astro screen and see excatly how far she is. After a whisle, I can see if she responded or if she is still moving out. This gives me the ability to make corrections without seeing the dog. Read this issue of PDJ. It has a good article about the astro from one of the smiths. WDO

gar-dog · Post by **gar-dog** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 11:10 am

whitedogone wrote:Astro.... But, it changed the way I hunt and hunting is much more stressfree.

Bingo! I ordered mine online yesterday. So let's see, bell, beeper, GPS tracking, and a giant spool of wire tied to my belt loop and the dog's collar. Am I missing anything?

whitedogone · Post by **whitedogone** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 3:54 pm

gar-dog wrote:
whitedogone wrote:Astro.... But, it changed the way I hunt and hunting is much more stressfree.
Bingo! I ordered mine online yesterday. So let's see, bell, beeper, GPS tracking, and a giant spool of wire tied to my belt loop and the dog's collar. Am I missing anything?

Yep, finding a breeder that is breeding them with longer necks. WDO

BigShooter · Post by **BigShooter** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 10:34 am

I know this thread is a little old but I've been offline for a while. I liked Ray's response. It is consistent with my views however as has been said many times on this site no two dogs nor situations are alike. My brothers and I have 7 shorthairs, four - six year old littermates, two related pups and one unrelated 1 1/2 y.o. The most experienced and accomplished dog owner in the family lost the littermates' dam while grouse hunting in Northern MN. years ago. The dog was found some time later by use of a vehicle, lost and scared, more than a mile away just off a logging road. The same dog was lost once on the prairies of N.D. My brother put up posters and received a call from a farmer a few days later after having traveled back to his home state without the dog. One of the dam's male offspring was located at dusk a mile away from the cover they were hunting in N.D. only through the use of a radio tracker. Who knows how long the dog would've held that point and what would have happened to the dog if they had to leave and travel back to camp 20 miles away without it? Another brother's littermate had to be cut off by use of a truck on section line roads on the N.D. prairies. My littermate bitch has gone over the hill 1/2 mile or more away many times but has always checked back with me or been found on point and has never been lost. All hunting has been on foot. Under certain hunting conditions with a young, big running, independent dog in single-minded pusuit of game one may find it very uncomfortable not to have a locate beeper, Astro or radio tracker. There are hazards you may wish your dog to avoid like roads, wolves, coyotes and unscrupulous individuals that may pick up or shoot a dog too far from your line of sight or hearing. Not all dogs make it back and just as importantly you may not have the time to wait for them to show up.

I started with a bell ... don't like the constant noise. I use a TT G2 with accessory beeper and have ordered an Astro from a GDF member. I like quiet hunting a lot. No one is allowed to slam the truck doors shut, those chinese invaders have sharp hearing!

bert01 · Post by **bert01** » Sun Oct 05, 2008 6:55 pm

Some really great posts here. For a first time dog owner i am not convinced of which is the right way but I do know that if I am not comfortable with the dog and the hunt it is not enjoyable. I have realized that some anxiety is normal but I wish to limit potential problems like roads and such by using a bell and beeper on point only mode. I have a young brittany that is close ranging (50-70 yards) most likely because I made her that way. IF we find birds great if we don't we'll try again. I guess the point is these posts truly do help the novice hunter and are a great tool. Thanks for posting. RayG - Thanks for the bit of confidence.

GSPVIZ · Post by **GSPVIZ** » Mon Oct 06, 2008 10:40 am

I was out at a WMA this weekend and all I heard was beepers going off. Oh my god it was annoying!

This was my first time hearing a beeper so I am convinced that I will never add one to my dog's collars.

mudhunter · Post by **mudhunter** » Mon Oct 06, 2008 12:27 pm

never say never, You need someway to locate the dog. When you loose the dog in the middle of the woods grouse hunting and you can't find him for hours (Ive been their) all that stress could have been saved if you Knew that dog was about to run out of whistle range.

Jweb · Post by **Jweb** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 10:16 pm

You know I have friends that say they are quiet and see more grouse because of it. That is until they hunt with me. I run (english) pointers and they range very wide in clearcut 2nd stage growth. I run my beeper on at all times and a custom bell that cuts through windy days. So I need my dogs to be loud or I'd never find them. I have a 9 year old pointer that points birds at a staggering rate. My friends all hunt with close working dogs and are quiet hunters (point only mode). They are still amazed that the grouse will hold for 5 mnutes sometimes, when the birds they are seeing are flushing seconds after they are pointed. My thoughts are that with my dogs I have taken the human out of the picture. The grouse are used to fox, coyotes and other four legged creatures, but not us. When a good dog hits scent and stops the grouse is alerted but not spooked. Its the human that spookes them after the point. It is the dog and the grouse one on one and if your dog doesn't hunt under your feet and gets a chance to go one on one then the bell and beepers don't really matter.

Petra · Post by **Petra** » Wed Oct 08, 2008 6:49 am

I agree with the last posting, that is exactly what I,m experiencing in the woods, I do use a point only beeper that I can also turn on and off with the transmitter, love it, I did try the hawk scream for the first time to see if the birds hold better, I don't know why because the held with the dog and the regular beeper, but i WAS SURPRISED THAT THE BIRDS were flushing fast, I watched one that I could see and it acted excited, fear, what ever it was they flushed fast, so I switched back to the reg. beep, and had better luck, it seems that it is my movement that flushs them not the dog.

gar-dog · Post by **gar-dog** » Wed Oct 08, 2008 6:53 am

Interesting perspective, Jweb. As this is my first time to hunt grouse, and the first hunt of my dog, I really have no expectations. I got the Astro this week and of course will strap it on. I will put the beeper on the e-collar, but only activate it remotely and see how that goes. Important thing to me is 1) I will NOT be working,2) I will be in the outdoors... of 3) a beautiful locale, and 4) spending time with my family.

G

Jweb · Post by **Jweb** » Wed Oct 08, 2008 7:04 am

I completely agree with the I wont be working comment. The other part to my post that I left out was that I completely trust my dogs. Some more than others but they will hold point for as long as it takes. If the bird gets up before I get there than the bird wins and I see him again some day. I only shoot at pointed birds, its hard but with our two bird limit daily I want to give the dogs as much time on the groud as possible. The real point of my first post was that it can be done anyway you are comfortable doing it. This is about the outdoors, the dogs, the birds, not working, etc... If your new to grouse hunting dont sweat the small things. Previous posts may be right that you need to be quiet for some birds but more often than not the dog learns how to get it done. Another observation I have had with birds that are pointed a long way from me is that unless the dog really pins the bird, they have no problem just walking away from the situation. Alot of my long finds the bird has moved away from the situation and I know that my dog has not pointed the bird that far away. Just release the dog he'll point again and you can get to work. If he flushes when the dog is relocating the grouse wins again.