Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

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KahlessDg
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Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by KahlessDg » Sat May 23, 2020 10:04 pm

I have a three year old GSP that I run long distances with. We average 30- 40 miles any given week. The long distance on pavement has caused him to have thin pads. When I take him out hunting or training, he easily gets cuts and thorns. Ive tried commercial boots in the past, but he always loses them. Yesterday I came up with the brilliant idea to make my own with duct tape. I put a toddler sock over one of the useless running boots I bought. I then used three strips of duct tape to wrap the boot. I cut partway down the sides to pull it off the boot. Did it 4 times and have 4 lined duct tape booties that look like silver Lewis boots. Today we went out training. I put them on my dog in the same way you would do the lewis boot. One of my hunting buddies was giving me a hard time. He said that a dogs main cooling is through heat transfer from his paws and that by putting the duct tape boots on, I was endangering my dogs life. The boots are not tight and I was wetting his ears, groin, and arm pits during our runs, like usual, and giving water after each bird. Any thoughts? Will my duct tape boots cause my dog to overheat?

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Garrison
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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by Garrison » Sun May 24, 2020 8:53 am

I think I would quit running the dog on the pavement.

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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by KahlessDg » Sun May 24, 2020 11:37 am

Has anyone ever tried cordura bog booties? Will they prevent stickers and thorn injury?
Last edited by KahlessDg on Sun May 24, 2020 11:37 am, edited 2 times in total.

KahlessDg
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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by KahlessDg » Sun May 24, 2020 11:40 am

Garrison wrote:I think I would quit running the dog on the pavement.
There aren't a lot of choices where I live for my weekday running. My dog has been my running buddy since he turned 18 months. I'm not going to leave him behind.

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Sharon
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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by Sharon » Sun May 24, 2020 3:38 pm

I don't think anyone can definitely say whether it is a good idea or a bad idea. Sounds like you keep a close eye on your dog during the run. Personally I'd probably use the duct tape unless I saw it was causing harm.
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Featherfinder
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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by Featherfinder » Mon May 25, 2020 11:05 am

I wish I could help. Anytime I've run dogs on pavement, their pads got stronger and stronger BUT, I didn't run them as near much as you do. The other aspect is that they had intervals between roading on the road which allowed the digital pads to strengthen/recover.
As for cordura boots, they are THE worst thing you can put on a dog. Stickers/thorns actually stick to them and often the very tip of the thorn snaps off either in the dog's paw or in the cordura bootie which is a constant source of re-aggravation for your dog!
Not unlike cordura chaps or boots, cordura has to be one of the worst ever concepts that has been extremely well marketed.
I've used to have a pair of cordura faced jeans for bird hunting. Every time I wore them, about 45 minutes later I'd start scratching, always the same spot. I checked myself repeatedly - nothing there!?! Finally, I figured out that the very tip of a thorn was nicely nestled in my cordura faced trousers. But, they looked good :roll: .
Actually, cordura is fine for occasional weekend hunter where looking good takes precedence over practical functionality.
Or, where there aren't thorns. Then again, why not just wear jeans?

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Dakotazeb
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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by Dakotazeb » Mon May 25, 2020 6:44 pm

First, to answer your original question. I do not believe booting your dog will cause him to over heat. I've run my dogs for many years with my bicycle on bike paths, streets and gravel roads. The only time it has affected the dog's feet was when running on concrete. That little bit of rougher surface really worn down the pads. Running on asphalt or gravel has never had a negative affect and it keeps the nail wore down so I rarely have to trim nails. What is the surface you are running your dog on?

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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by KahlessDg » Mon May 25, 2020 10:47 pm

Featherfinder wrote:I wish I could help. Anytime I've run dogs on pavement, their pads got stronger and stronger BUT, I didn't run them as near much as you do. The other aspect is that they had intervals between roading on the road which allowed the digital pads to strengthen/recover.
As for cordura boots, they are THE worst thing you can put on a dog. Stickers/thorns actually stick to them and often the very tip of the thorn snaps off either in the dog's paw or in the cordura bootie which is a constant source of re-aggravation for your dog!
Not unlike cordura chaps or boots, cordura has to be one of the worst ever concepts that has been extremely well marketed.
I've used to have a pair of cordura faced jeans for bird hunting. Every time I wore them, about 45 minutes later I'd start scratching, always the same spot. I checked myself repeatedly - nothing there!?! Finally, I figured out that the very tip of a thorn was nicely nestled in my cordura faced trousers. But, they looked good :roll: .
Actually, cordura is fine for occasional weekend hunter where looking good takes precedence over practical functionality.
Or, where there aren't thorns. Then again, why not just wear jeans?
Good to know about the cordura boots. I have seen some of the guys complaining about the jeans. Since they don't make them wor women, I bought Arborwear jeans. They are a canvas like material. Ive walked through briars with no issues, and they look good!

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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by KahlessDg » Mon May 25, 2020 10:58 pm

Dakotazeb wrote:First, to answer your original question. I do not believe booting your dog will cause him to over heat. I've run my dogs for many years with my bicycle on bike paths, streets and gravel roads. The only time it has affected the dog's feet was when running on concrete. That little bit of rougher surface really worn down the pads. Running on asphalt or gravel has never had a negative affect and it keeps the nail wore down so I rarely have to trim nails. What is the surface you are running your dog on?
I run about 70% on asphalt, in the street. Whenever there is an option to jump on a trail for a but, I take it. The trails I near me are primarily dirt as opposed to gravel or DG. I had hoped his pads would toughen up, but they never have. Odd thing too, all the miles and it doesn't wear down his nails. I've only used the boots when bird training or hunting because of the stickers, cactus, shale, or glass (on BLM, some jerks leave behind broken beer bottles.) we usually run early enough to not worry about the hot pavement.

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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by Meller » Tue May 26, 2020 6:03 am

Have you tried the boots made from bicycle innertubes? Might give that a try!

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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by Featherfinder » Tue May 26, 2020 6:45 am

Thanks KahlessDg. Arborwear makes some nice stuff!

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Garrison
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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by Garrison » Tue May 26, 2020 10:03 am

There is no great answer for dog boots.

Bike innertube with vet wrap and duct tape is tough, but a pain to put on and it will rub the paws raw in other places.

The cordura are easy to put on, fairly cheap, and fit pretty well, but as featherfinder has noted lack protection on some surfaces.

My answer:

I order a bunch of the sled dog cordura boots, I leave some alone for ice and snow conditions. Others I will dip the bottoms in a flexible rubberized product. Boot tough toe or tool dip. If I am in some rough chukar country and my dog is going get a flat tire I have them on deck to keep the hunt going.

Depending on conditions they will usually last a couple days.

Install is key to not losing boots. Vet wrap, one layer of tape, I like sticky side facing out. Put the boot on and then sandwich the boot with one more piece of tape.

If your dog’s feet can’t handle a normal day in a field. (not lava rock rough chukar conditions) then you might want to re-asses your choice to run his pads off on a daily basis.

I have read zinc supplementation can help pad growth.

Garrison
Last edited by Garrison on Tue May 26, 2020 1:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by polmaise » Tue May 26, 2020 11:51 am

KahlessDg wrote:
Sat May 23, 2020 10:04 pm
I have a three year old GSP that I run long distances with. We average 30- 40 miles any given week. The long distance on pavement has caused him to have thin pads. When I take him out hunting or training, he easily gets cuts and thorns. Ive tried commercial boots in the past, but he always loses them. Yesterday I came up with the brilliant idea to make my own with duct tape. I put a toddler sock over one of the useless running boots I bought. I then used three strips of duct tape to wrap the boot. I cut partway down the sides to pull it off the boot. Did it 4 times and have 4 lined duct tape booties that look like silver Lewis boots. Today we went out training. I put them on my dog in the same way you would do the lewis boot. One of my hunting buddies was giving me a hard time. He said that a dogs main cooling is through heat transfer from his paws and that by putting the duct tape boots on, I was endangering my dogs life. The boots are not tight and I was wetting his ears, groin, and arm pits during our runs, like usual, and giving water after each bird. Any thoughts? Will my duct tape boots cause my dog to overheat?

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A 3 year old GSP is well capable of running 30-40 miles a week (that's about 5 miles a day) ! Now ,doing 5 miles a day every week for a year has other complications and factors you probably won't consider as your buddy either can't or ,you won't want to leave him while you do what You want to do .
Roading ..or running at a constant pace on surface designed for humans with 'Nike' or other top gear stuff is not the best for any dog , let alone a GSP ,that is 'Flat footed' (running on it's pads, rather than driving with it's Toes! ) You did say , it's nails don't wear even on tarmac ..yea? ..
Always perplexed when folk look for a fix on how not to do something ,rather than 'Just do it' . (Nike) ...Leave the dog to run those 5 miles at it's own hunting pace rather than 'Force marched' at yours ? and on it's own 'Turf' rather than yours ! A gsp will do the distance , them some and you can take a rest and just enjoy the view . ....Or you can do what you are doing and buy duct tape and cripple the dog to have a shorter life . It will still run for sure , such are these loyal companions in the kennel now and then to get rest away from humans to re-charge their loyalty . Till tomorrow :)

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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by Dakotazeb » Tue May 26, 2020 1:38 pm

KahlessDg wrote:
Mon May 25, 2020 10:58 pm
I run about 70% on asphalt, in the street. Whenever there is an option to jump on a trail for a but, I take it. The trails I near me are primarily dirt as opposed to gravel or DG. I had hoped his pads would toughen up, but they never have. Odd thing too, all the miles and it doesn't wear down his nails. I've only used the boots when bird training or hunting because of the stickers, cactus, shale, or glass (on BLM, some jerks leave behind broken beer bottles.) we usually run early enough to not worry about the hot pavement.

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The difference is that you are running with your dog at probably a 4-6 mph pace. I run my dog with my bicycle for 5-7 miles at an average of 10-12 mph. She is running and pulling me at the same time. Digging in with her nails. This is just part of her overall conditioning program. We probably go with the bike 2-3 times a week and I also take her to the field a couple times a week to just free run for 30-60 minutes. I often give her a day off between runs as I believe the rest is as important as the exercise. When I was younger and did a lot of running myself I rarely ran back to back days. Same with lifting weights, etc. The body needs time between workouts to recover and muscles to heal. While a dog is different than a human I do believe in giving them days off.

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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by polmaise » Tue May 26, 2020 1:51 pm

Dakotazeb wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 1:38 pm


The difference is that you are running with your dog at probably a 4-6 mph pace. I run my dog with my bicycle for 5-7 miles at an average of 10-12 mph. She is running and pulling me at the same time. Digging in with her nails. This is just part of her overall conditioning program. We probably go with the bike 2-3 times a week and I also take her to the field a couple times a week to just free run for 30-60 minutes. I often give her a day off between runs as I believe the rest is as important as the exercise. When I was younger and did a lot of running myself I rarely ran back to back days. Same with lifting weights, etc. The body needs time between workouts to recover and muscles to heal. While a dog is different than a human I do believe in giving them days off.
:mrgreen: :roll: Backpedaling is like slimey not running,just going somewhere with the wind on your back. .Disappointed I thought better.
Sounds like Power training , or even 'Kani' train a dog. Perhaps ? with the very best and politically correct best intentions of course.

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Re: Will booting my GSP cause him to overheat

Post by birddogger2 » Wed May 27, 2020 12:39 pm

KahlessDg -

The short answer is NO. Booting a dog will NOT cause it to overheat.

The blood vessels in a dog's legs go straight up and down, carrying the heat from the dog's core to its extremities. THAT(along with fur) is what allows a dog to run in subzero weather without its toes falling off from frostbite. It is not about transference of heat with the dog's feet, it is about maintenance of body temperature in the extremities. Dogs shed heat via radiational cooling(especially evaporation) and panting, The radiational cooling and evaporative effect is why you wet a dog down in hot weather.

IMO the thing one has to be much more mindful of, when running on pavement...is the heat of the road surface. The heat on blacktop that has been baking in the sun...and even concrete, can blister a dog's feet, PDQ. When I used to exercise my dogs by roading them on foot around the subdivision, I would always go out and physically touch the road surface. If it was hot to the touch...I would not put the dogs on it. Sometimes that meant we went around well after dark...but that is what I needed to do.

As far as thinning the pads, I have no real answer for you. I have found that having dogs walk on and exercise on river stone tends to toughen up their pads better than anything. I try to develop a tough, yet flexible and resilient pad. That seems to work out the best.

Of course, some dogs just naturally"float" over the ground, while others will dig in and hit it hard. All else being equal, The light footed dog's pads seem to do much better, obviously.

RayG

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