Lesser Breeds
- birddogger
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Re: Lesser Breeds
I hear ya Munster, I can't imagine why anybody would care what breed another person chooses. I happen to like most all of them, usually each for a different reason but the GSP's happen to have the looks and style that fit what I want and need at this time. That doesn't mean I think they are better or "lesser" but it is easy to find good well bred ones, usually within driving distance, just about anytime I might be in the market for one. Just one more thought, one reason I enjoyed the NAVHDA events was to watch and enjoy the variety of breeds and for the most part, I have admired them all for one reason or another.
Charlie
Charlie
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- Cora's Shadow
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Re: Lesser Breeds
I know I'm a little late here, but wanted to give my thoughts on the OP's original question. I choose to own Deutsch Langhaars because I think they are the best breed for me. I grew up hunting with GSPs and as an adult, have owned an English Setter and a Small Munsterlander. I have trained with countless numbers of GSPs, GWPs, DDs, Griffons, Viszlas, Pudelpointers, Brittanies, etc. in our local NAVHDA chapter and guided with many of these dogs at youth hunts. I am currently helping a friend train her 7-month old Pointer pup. And yet, I still find DLs to best suite my needs as a hunter.Can someone please explain to me the appeal of the lesser pointing (or I guess flushing as well) breeds? I m talking Bracco Italianos, Braque du bourbonnais, German Longhair Pointers, Clumber Spaniels, Field Spaniels.... I just don't understand why people would go with a rarer breed when it seems like the more popular breeds are better bred, better proven, more driven ect..
I like dogs that I can take duck hunting in the morning and grouse/rabbit hunting in the afternoon. I like a dog that I can hunt close for woodcock in Wisconsin but run fast and hard all day in South Dakota for pheasants. I like having a dog to blood-track wounded deer during the archery season and I like having a dog that is calm, cooperative, and fast-maturing. In the German system, our dogs must essentially be finished by the time they are 2 years of age. Consequently, we often start force-breaking our dogs at 6-10 months of age and expect them to be steady to wing, shot, and fall by 18 months of age as well. We hunt them early as well. I've had pups pointing/retrieving ruffed grouse at 4 months of age and making marked waterfowl retrieves.
I know that the original poster was trying to make a blanket statement about all less-common breeds, but that is a slippery slope. I won't concede that any popular breed is "better bred" or "better proven" than our DLs. EVERY SINGLE DOG in our dogs' pedigrees has proven their abilities by passing at least 2 hunting tests (usually 3) and has proven their conformation/temperament in at least 1 breed show before they are certified for breeding. EVERY SINGLE DOG in our dogs' pedigrees has had their hips x-rayed as well. I have not seen any GSPs, labs, pointers, etc. where every single dog in the pedigree has a bench championship title, a performance title, and health clearances.
And the comment about all less common breed being less driven is WAY off base. I'm guessing the original poster hasn't even met a DL or some of the other breeds mentioned. Almost every DL I have ever seen making a water retrieve has whimpered or barked with anticipation of making the retrieve. My one female bays like a beagle when she sees a wounded duck trying to swim away. And they hunt hard all day regardless of the temperature, cuts, etc. There are reasons why DLs are not incredibly common yet but it has nothing to do with their ability or their drive. It has a lot more to do with the fact that we really only gained full access to these dogs from Germany in 2008. If anyone would like to meet a DL in person to see what they are really like, please shoot me a PM and I'll put you in touch with someone who owns one nearby.
I don't think that DLs are the best breed in the world for everyone, but I do take some offense when someone says that they don't have any drive or that I can't be a serious hunter since I own them. I don't care if folks want to own a different breed, but there is no need to bash someone else's choice just because you aren't familiar with their dogs.
Re: Lesser Breeds
You can say that again. I was at the Hegewald in Germany in 2002 for the 100th year celebration...and walked with a group and some dogs I was interested in. When it came to the field search, my friend unleashed his bitch (Aike vom Boeckenhagen) which promptly scorched about 500 yds of hedgerow that surrounded this huge open grass/brush area. He whistled which brought her around to the front about 300 yds out. I can see the German judges just shaking their heads....meanwhile, I'm hoping this dog fails so I can buy her cheap (yeah, I'm that kind of guy). She didn't pass but did well the following week at another test...anyone would have felt right at home in the saddle with that dog.And the comment about all less common breed being less driven is WAY off base
- ultracarry
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Re: Lesser Breeds
Cora's Shadow wrote:I know I'm a little late here, but wanted to give my thoughts on the OP's original question. I choose to own Deutsch Langhaars because I think they are the best breed for me. I grew up hunting with GSPs and as an adult, have owned an English Setter and a Small Munsterlander. I have trained with countless numbers of GSPs, GWPs, DDs, Griffons, Viszlas, Pudelpointers, Brittanies, etc. in our local NAVHDA chapter and guided with many of these dogs at youth hunts. I am currently helping a friend train her 7-month old Pointer pup. And yet, I still find DLs to best suite my needs as a hunter.Can someone please explain to me the appeal of the lesser pointing (or I guess flushing as well) breeds? I m talking Bracco Italianos, Braque du bourbonnais, German Longhair Pointers, Clumber Spaniels, Field Spaniels.... I just don't understand why people would go with a rarer breed when it seems like the more popular breeds are better bred, better proven, more driven ect..
I like dogs that I can take duck hunting in the morning and grouse/rabbit hunting in the afternoon. I like a dog that I can hunt close for woodcock in Wisconsin but run fast and hard all day in South Dakota for pheasants. I like having a dog to blood-track wounded deer during the archery season and I like having a dog that is calm, cooperative, and fast-maturing. In the German system, our dogs must essentially be finished by the time they are 2 years of age. Consequently, we often start force-breaking our dogs at 6-10 months of age and expect them to be steady to wing, shot, and fall by 18 months of age as well. We hunt them early as well. I've had pups pointing/retrieving ruffed grouse at 4 months of age and making marked waterfowl retrieves.
I know that the original poster was trying to make a blanket statement about all less-common breeds, but that is a slippery slope. I won't concede that any popular breed is "better bred" or "better proven" than our DLs. EVERY SINGLE DOG in our dogs' pedigrees has proven their abilities by passing at least 2 hunting tests (usually 3) and has proven their conformation/temperament in at least 1 breed show before they are certified for breeding. EVERY SINGLE DOG in our dogs' pedigrees has had their hips x-rayed as well. I have not seen any GSPs, labs, pointers, etc. where every single dog in the pedigree has a bench championship title, a performance title, and health clearances.
And the comment about all less common breed being less driven is WAY off base. I'm guessing the original poster hasn't even met a DL or some of the other breeds mentioned. Almost every DL I have ever seen making a water retrieve has whimpered or barked with anticipation of making the retrieve. My one female bays like a beagle when she sees a wounded duck trying to swim away. And they hunt hard all day regardless of the temperature, cuts, etc. There are reasons why DLs are not incredibly common yet but it has nothing to do with their ability or their drive. It has a lot more to do with the fact that we really only gained full access to these dogs from Germany in 2008. If anyone would like to meet a DL in person to see what they are really like, please shoot me a PM and I'll put you in touch with someone who owns one nearby.
I don't think that DLs are the best breed in the world for everyone, but I do take some offense when someone says that they don't have any drive or that I can't be a serious hunter since I own them. I don't care if folks want to own a different breed, but there is no need to bash someone else's choice just because you aren't familiar with their dogs.
Since you bash other dl owners for not living up to your expectation and not following your orders, do you blame people for not wanting some of your stock?
Re: Lesser Breeds
:roll: :roll:ultracarry wrote:Cora's Shadow wrote:I know I'm a little late here, but wanted to give my thoughts on the OP's original question. I choose to own Deutsch Langhaars because I think they are the best breed for me. I grew up hunting with GSPs and as an adult, have owned an English Setter and a Small Munsterlander. I have trained with countless numbers of GSPs, GWPs, DDs, Griffons, Viszlas, Pudelpointers, Brittanies, etc. in our local NAVHDA chapter and guided with many of these dogs at youth hunts. I am currently helping a friend train her 7-month old Pointer pup. And yet, I still find DLs to best suite my needs as a hunter.Can someone please explain to me the appeal of the lesser pointing (or I guess flushing as well) breeds? I m talking Bracco Italianos, Braque du bourbonnais, German Longhair Pointers, Clumber Spaniels, Field Spaniels.... I just don't understand why people would go with a rarer breed when it seems like the more popular breeds are better bred, better proven, more driven ect..
I like dogs that I can take duck hunting in the morning and grouse/rabbit hunting in the afternoon. I like a dog that I can hunt close for woodcock in Wisconsin but run fast and hard all day in South Dakota for pheasants. I like having a dog to blood-track wounded deer during the archery season and I like having a dog that is calm, cooperative, and fast-maturing. In the German system, our dogs must essentially be finished by the time they are 2 years of age. Consequently, we often start force-breaking our dogs at 6-10 months of age and expect them to be steady to wing, shot, and fall by 18 months of age as well. We hunt them early as well. I've had pups pointing/retrieving ruffed grouse at 4 months of age and making marked waterfowl retrieves.
I know that the original poster was trying to make a blanket statement about all less-common breeds, but that is a slippery slope. I won't concede that any popular breed is "better bred" or "better proven" than our DLs. EVERY SINGLE DOG in our dogs' pedigrees has proven their abilities by passing at least 2 hunting tests (usually 3) and has proven their conformation/temperament in at least 1 breed show before they are certified for breeding. EVERY SINGLE DOG in our dogs' pedigrees has had their hips x-rayed as well. I have not seen any GSPs, labs, pointers, etc. where every single dog in the pedigree has a bench championship title, a performance title, and health clearances.
And the comment about all less common breed being less driven is WAY off base. I'm guessing the original poster hasn't even met a DL or some of the other breeds mentioned. Almost every DL I have ever seen making a water retrieve has whimpered or barked with anticipation of making the retrieve. My one female bays like a beagle when she sees a wounded duck trying to swim away. And they hunt hard all day regardless of the temperature, cuts, etc. There are reasons why DLs are not incredibly common yet but it has nothing to do with their ability or their drive. It has a lot more to do with the fact that we really only gained full access to these dogs from Germany in 2008. If anyone would like to meet a DL in person to see what they are really like, please shoot me a PM and I'll put you in touch with someone who owns one nearby.
I don't think that DLs are the best breed in the world for everyone, but I do take some offense when someone says that they don't have any drive or that I can't be a serious hunter since I own them. I don't care if folks want to own a different breed, but there is no need to bash someone else's choice just because you aren't familiar with their dogs.
Since you bash other dl owners for not living up to your expectation and not following your orders, do you blame people for not wanting some of your stock?
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- birddogger
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Re: Lesser Breeds
Amen!I don't think that DLs are the best breed in the world for everyone, but I do take some offense when someone says that they don't have any drive or that I can't be a serious hunter since I own them. I don't care if folks want to own a different breed, but there is no need to bash someone else's choice just because you aren't familiar with their dogs.
Charlie
If you think you can or if you think you can't, you are right either way
Re: Lesser Breeds
Okay.. I wasn't trying to inflame hearts. see the "bleeps lions" at the end? I had to post something that would cause controversy, because I lost a bet. I always wondered this anyways, so I figured it would be a good thing to post. But I was serious when I asked the question. I just seems to me to my young and untrained eyes that they do seem less driven. and yes I am part of Navhda, so I have seen versatile breeds anyways, but no real "rare" breeds unless you consider a spinone or a drathaar. They are not for me. No one really answered my question, 55 posts of going round and round. What originally made you want your rare breed? what drew you to them? I understand about the breeding, and I respect that, I didnt realize so many breeds had such stringent breeding programs. However, in terms of competition on bird abilities, I still think that "american" breeds would win out, hince my proven and driven part.KellyM87 wrote:Can someone please explain to me the appeal of the lesser pointing (or I guess flushing as well) breeds? I m talking Bracco Italianos, Braque du bourbonnais, German Longhair Pointers, Clumber Spaniels, Field Spaniels.... I just don't understand why people would go with a rarer breed when it seems like the more popular breeds are better bred, better proven, more driven ect..
"bleep" Lions.
- Winchey
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Re: Lesser Breeds
I read breed descriptions and at the time in which I got a Small Munsterlander, I simply wanted a dog that would mostly retrieve ducks and point some birds. I liked the temperament description and look of the breed better then the rest of the breeds, and everything I read said they excel at water work. I didn't care about range or style, was looking more for a close working dog. Since the Germans seem to breed their dogs to shine after the shot more so then before, that is the route I went. If you are talking about excelling at American bird competitions the answer is simple. American bread dogs are bread for those competitions where German bread dogs are not bread for those competitions.
- nikegundog
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Re: Lesser Breeds
You bet on the Lions? Thats crazyKellyM87 wrote:Okay.. I wasn't trying to inflame hearts. see the "bleeps lions" at the end? I had to post something that would cause controversy, because I lost a bet. I always wondered this anyways, so I figured it would be a good thing to post. But I was serious when I asked the question. I just seems to me to my young and untrained eyes that they do seem less driven. and yes I am part of Navhda, so I have seen versatile breeds anyways, but no real "rare" breeds unless you consider a spinone or a drathaar. They are not for me. No one really answered my question, 55 posts of going round and round. What originally made you want your rare breed? what drew you to them? I understand about the breeding, and I respect that, I didnt realize so many breeds had such stringent breeding programs. However, in terms of competition on bird abilities, I still think that "american" breeds would win out, hince my proven and driven part.KellyM87 wrote:Can someone please explain to me the appeal of the lesser pointing (or I guess flushing as well) breeds? I m talking Bracco Italianos, Braque du bourbonnais, German Longhair Pointers, Clumber Spaniels, Field Spaniels.... I just don't understand why people would go with a rarer breed when it seems like the more popular breeds are better bred, better proven, more driven ect..
"bleep" Lions.
- chiendog
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Re: Lesser Breeds
Personally, when I started out I didn't really think about getting into any particular breed. When I was finally in a position to get a dog I just wanted a good individual like one dog I saw that really impressed me. It was a Weim I saw hunting sharptails out here and I thought, wow! I want one just like that (looking back, I now realize the odds of me stumbling over a good Weim in the field were astronomical...so maybe it was fate ) And then a few years later, I was in France and met a guy who breeds Pont Audemer Spaniels. He came to Canada twice with his dogs and one of them in particular was outstanding. My wife and I both said wow! I want one just like that so we got a Ponto pup from that breeder.What originally made you want your rare breed? what drew you to them?
I think that if I had started out by seeing a really good (place breed name here) instead of a Weim or if a different French breeder came over to hunt with equally outstanding dogs before the Ponto guy came over, I probably would have said wow! I want one just like that and ended up with a (place breed name here).
I am now much more educated on the various breeds than I was when I started, but I am still not really a breed guy. In fact for my next dog, the main thing I am looking for is a lot of white due to my middle aged eyes and the increasing difficulty of seeing my deer-colored dogs in the field. So I will look for an individual...with alot of white in the coat... that makes me say wow! I want one just like that.
I don't really care if it is a Pointer, Setter, French Spaniel or Braque de l'Ariege. Common or rare, its gotta make me say wow! I want one just like that
Re: Lesser Breeds
WOW. I dont know these guys but I think Chiendog and Winchey covered all the bases on why we picked our breed. SInce then, I have been wowed by another breed, but am not sure I am willing to "cheat" on my SM's yet!
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- ACooper
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Re: Lesser Breeds
DL?Munster wrote:WOW. I dont know these guys but I think Chiendog and Winchey covered all the bases on why we picked our breed. SInce then, I have been wowed by another breed, but am not sure I am willing to "cheat" on my SM's yet!
- Coveyrise64
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Re: Lesser Breeds
No, DK........ACooper wrote:DL?Munster wrote:WOW. I dont know these guys but I think Chiendog and Winchey covered all the bases on why we picked our breed. SInce then, I have been wowed by another breed, but am not sure I am willing to "cheat" on my SM's yet!
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- ACooper
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Re: Lesser Breeds
Gettin closer!Coveyrise64 wrote:No, DK........ACooper wrote:DL?Munster wrote:WOW. I dont know these guys but I think Chiendog and Winchey covered all the bases on why we picked our breed. SInce then, I have been wowed by another breed, but am not sure I am willing to "cheat" on my SM's yet!
Re: Lesser Breeds
Coveyrise64 wrote:No, DK........ACooper wrote:DL?Munster wrote:WOW. I dont know these guys but I think Chiendog and Winchey covered all the bases on why we picked our breed. SInce then, I have been wowed by another breed, but am not sure I am willing to "cheat" on my SM's yet!
LMAO, I guess I had 2 I was going to cheat on my Munsters with.
No, truth be told it would be the DL if anything. It all goes back to the "I Likes what I Likes". I like dogs like I like my man. Hairy and with a long TAIL .
DK's are appealing to me though as I have been around them more and more. But dont like the coat.They are great dogs
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- ultracarry
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Re: Lesser Breeds
Being a part of NAVHDA don't you see more of the lesser dogs within the breed?KellyM87 wrote:Okay.. I wasn't trying to inflame hearts. see the "bleeps lions" at the end? I had to post something that would cause controversy, because I lost a bet. I always wondered this anyways, so I figured it would be a good thing to post. But I was serious when I asked the question. I just seems to me to my young and untrained eyes that they do seem less driven. and yes I am part of Navhda, so I have seen versatile breeds anyways, but no real "rare" breeds unless you consider a spinone or a drathaar. They are not for me. No one really answered my question, 55 posts of going round and round. What originally made you want your rare breed? what drew you to them? I understand about the breeding, and I respect that, I didnt realize so many breeds had such stringent breeding programs. However, in terms of competition on bird abilities, I still think that "american" breeds would win out, hince my proven and driven part.KellyM87 wrote:Can someone please explain to me the appeal of the lesser pointing (or I guess flushing as well) breeds? I m talking Bracco Italianos, Braque du bourbonnais, German Longhair Pointers, Clumber Spaniels, Field Spaniels.... I just don't understand why people would go with a rarer breed when it seems like the more popular breeds are better bred, better proven, more driven ect..
"bleep" Lions.
Re: Lesser Breeds
I just mentioned the rare breeds I see when I go to NAVHDA. its mostly shorthairs where I am from. Some Spinones, some Drathaars, some griffons, that is it.
Re: Lesser Breeds
KellyM87 wrote:I just mentioned the rare breeds I see when I go to NAVHDA. its mostly shorthairs where I am from. Some Spinones, some Drathaars, some griffons, that is it.
Thanks for clearing that up Kelly. Nice to see that we didnt actually make the short list on the "lesser breeds" LMAO
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Re: Lesser Breeds
you didn't read the whole thing conversation. I said we don't really have any rare breeds, and that the breeders listed above were the rarest.Munster wrote:KellyM87 wrote:I just mentioned the rare breeds I see when I go to NAVHDA. its mostly shorthairs where I am from. Some Spinones, some Drathaars, some griffons, that is it.
Thanks for clearing that up Kelly. Nice to see that we didnt actually make the short list on the "lesser breeds" LMAO
- Cora's Shadow
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Re: Lesser Breeds
I grew up hunting with my dad's lab and uncle's GSPs and they were all decent hunting dogs, but really hyper and never allowed in the house. We also had a really nice Golden Retriever when I was in high school, but she wasn't worth much as a hunting dog. So when I was in college and could finally get my own hunting dog, I wanted a dog that could hunt and be a calm pet in the house. I was also drawn to longer-haired breeds...not sure why. I just always like the look of them more...maybe because the Golden Retriever we had was such a nice dog. So originally, I was planning to get either a setter or a Golden Retriever. I looked at a few Golden kennels but was overwhelmed with the number of health issues and the huge split between hunting dogs and show dogs. It seemed difficult to find a good-looking dog that could hunt. Also, I decided that I would prefer a pointing dog because I thought it would improve my shooting to have a little more time to prepare for a shot.What originally made you want your rare breed? what drew you to them?
After watching more pointing dogs work, I discovered that I just preferred that style of hunting as well. So I set about to find a nice English Setter or Gordon Setter. But the problem was that I really got into duck hunting in my last year of college. I now wanted a dog that I could take duck hunting in the morning and sage grouse hunting in the afternoon (I lived in Laramie,Wyoming at the time). I talked to setter breeders but none of them sounded confident that their dogs would enjoy a cold morning duck hunt and retrieve reliably without being force-broke (and at the time, I wasn't confident that I could force-break a dog). So anyways, that led me to versatile dogs. And since I had always found long-haired dogs more aesthetically pleasing, I gravitated towards SMs, LMs, DLs, French Spaniels, Picardies, etc. The French breeds seemed too rare to even find a puppy but there were a lot of SM and LM litters available. I ended up getting a Small Munsterlander puppy from the breeder that lived closest to my parents' house (I would later learn that this is not a good way to select a puppy). I was unsatisfied with that particular dog so after 3 years, I sold him and switched to a similar-looking breed (DL) because of the stringent breeding program.
I would still like to get a really nice English Setter someday. I did get an English Setter pup when my first DL was about 1 year old. She was a Llewellin Setter from a breeder in the Upper Peninsula. Unfortunately, the dog was a weak pointer nd she wouldn't retrieve to save her life. She would go out and nose a dead/shot bird, but then just take off looking for the next one to flush. So we eventually gave her away and have really only had DLs since. But I would like to try get a nice English Setter again someday and try a few field trials. I'll just be a lot pickier on the pedigree and the breeder the next time.
Re: Lesser Breeds
But doing what? What is your "wow factor"? I'll bet mine is different than yours.Common or rare, its gotta make me say wow! I want one just like that
Once you get over the 800lb Gorilla in the room ...the fast and as far as possible bird dog culture...and stop apologizing for liking what you like....it is very understandable why so many folks are attracted to the "lesser" breeds.
There is a certain attitude among some (not all) that the owners of lesser breeds have them because they don't know any better...or they are scared of competition...or don't know what style is....daduh ..daduh..daduh
If you could take the ego out of dogs....we would all be able to understand batter.
When you come down to it, many breeds are interchangeable to a GREAT degree...we can find Pointers, GSP, GWP, Britts, Setters, etc that could all the do the work of the other on a given day...save the very extreme dogs. We own what we do...IMO...because we like the way they look and act when not hunting...as much as the performance. They please us....its not any more complicated than that...and for those "to the max" driven enthusiasts...maybe you'll get it some day.
- chiendog
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Re: Lesser Breeds
But doing what?
Hunting the way I like to see a dog hunt.
Its nearly an impossible question to answer beyond vague generalities, but I guess a dog that wows me is a dog that works hard every second it is on the ground, handles easy, hunts fast but at a close to medium range, slams point, fetches what I shoot, backs other dogs, finds game where others missed it ... plus a bunch of other impossible-to-describe things that for whatever reason, float my boat.What is your "wow factor"?
I mean my wife is beautiful, smart, witty, charming but there are lots of other beautiful, smart, witty, charming women in the world. What made me say WOW the minute I met her? I don't know but I am still saying WOW 25 years later
- Winchey
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Re: Lesser Breeds
"save the very extreme dogs. We own what we do...IMO...because we like the way they look and act when not hunting...as much as the performance. They please us....its not any more complicated than that...and for those "to the max" driven enthusiasts...maybe you'll get it some day."
It seems that maybe you still do not "get it". I know an AF AA Runoff Pointer that is as docile and easy going in the house and yard as any dog, hunting dog or otherwise.
It seems that maybe you still do not "get it". I know an AF AA Runoff Pointer that is as docile and easy going in the house and yard as any dog, hunting dog or otherwise.
Re: Lesser Breeds
Winchey,
I never used the word "run off" .. seems like everytime I allude to the farthest, hardest charging dogs, I have to use a disclaimer lest someone skip to accusations. My statement was about performance...that dogs except for the very extreme athletes are interchangeable in large part on the basis of performance. Try to read the post again....without the chip on your shoulder
I never used the word "run off" .. seems like everytime I allude to the farthest, hardest charging dogs, I have to use a disclaimer lest someone skip to accusations. My statement was about performance...that dogs except for the very extreme athletes are interchangeable in large part on the basis of performance. Try to read the post again....without the chip on your shoulder
- Winchey
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Re: Lesser Breeds
JKP wrote:Winchey,
I never used the word "run off" .. seems like everytime I allude to the farthest, hardest charging dogs, I have to use a disclaimer lest someone skip to accusations. My statement was about performance...that dogs except for the very extreme athletes are interchangeable in large part on the basis of performance. Try to read the post again....without the chip on your shoulder
I think I read it just fine, you took a dig at people who like extreme dogs. And no you did not use the words "run off", I did. Why? Because the dog washed out of the AA league because he is a run off.
Re: Lesser Breeds
I love that there are so many various breeds of dogs.The best part of NAHDA for me is to just look at all the different breeds hunt in their own way. Its way more fun and adds a little spice to the hunt. I think the whole question is pretty stupid. Why doesn't every one drive the same car since they all do the same thing? Why doesn't everyone use the same shotgun?
If every single person had the same dog it would be boring. How fun would it be if every women in the world looked the same. Haha The more dog breeds the better. They is something perfect for everyone.
If every single person had the same dog it would be boring. How fun would it be if every women in the world looked the same. Haha The more dog breeds the better. They is something perfect for everyone.
Re: Lesser Breeds
I some time think if we didn't have to deal with dog owners we could have a great time with any dog. Wonder if the dogs sit around and talk about dog handlers range and performance ot is that just us that do that.eebstein wrote:I love that there are so many various breeds of dogs.The best part of NAHDA for me is to just look at all the different breeds hunt in their own way. Its way more fun and adds a little spice to the hunt. I think the whole question is pretty stupid. Why doesn't every one drive the same car since they all do the same thing? Why doesn't everyone use the same shotgun?
If every single person had the same dog it would be boring. How fun would it be if every women in the world looked the same. Haha The more dog breeds the better. They is something perfect for everyone.
Ezzy
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=144
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=207
It's not how many breaths you have taken but how many times it has been taken away!
Has anyone noticed common sense isn't very common anymore.
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=207
It's not how many breaths you have taken but how many times it has been taken away!
Has anyone noticed common sense isn't very common anymore.
Re: Lesser Breeds
+-1ezzy333 wrote:I some time think if we didn't have to deal with dog owners we could have a great time with any dog. Wonder if the dogs sit around and talk about dog handlers range and performance ot is that just us that do that.eebstein wrote:I love that there are so many various breeds of dogs.The best part of NAHDA for me is to just look at all the different breeds hunt in their own way. Its way more fun and adds a little spice to the hunt. I think the whole question is pretty stupid. Why doesn't every one drive the same car since they all do the same thing? Why doesn't everyone use the same shotgun?
If every single person had the same dog it would be boring. How fun would it be if every women in the world looked the same. Haha The more dog breeds the better. They is something perfect for everyone.
Ezzy
Re: Lesser Breeds
We live in America...we are constantly ordering best to worst on everything...nowhere in the world are there so many people making a living criticizing the work, product and choices of others. Being the best is a national obsession...its part of what makes this country great...as long as you realize that perfection is often the enemy of very good...and there is nothing wrong with very good.........while you're working for perfectionWhy doesn't every one drive the same car since they all do the same thing? Why doesn't everyone use the same shotgun?
- birddogger
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Re: Lesser Breeds
FWIW, IMO you stated your opinion very well and I didn't see anything to be misunderstood.JKP wrote:Winchey,
I never used the word "run off" .. seems like everytime I allude to the farthest, hardest charging dogs, I have to use a disclaimer lest someone skip to accusations. My statement was about performance...that dogs except for the very extreme athletes are interchangeable in large part on the basis of performance. Try to read the post again....without the chip on your shoulder
Charlie
If you think you can or if you think you can't, you are right either way
Re: Lesser Breeds
I have owned several different breeds over the years. At one point I had two GSP's and a Gordon Setter, and even had a Britt in the mix. I think for me it was about the work of the breed. I just love being behind a great dog. There are great things that I have seen with each breed that I have owned. I don't believe that it has made it better than another breed just made it great in the field. It had it's own compliments for what I was looking for.
I think it was more of a mood thing. When I was in the mood to move and get at it, my GSP's were just go get em and cover tons of ground. It was always hit it and git it. When I had no where to be and just felt mellow or had one of my uncles or my dad with me or even my grandfather, my britt and especially my gordon was the dog to be behind. It was a great dog to thick cover. I am not saying my GSP's couldn't cover the ground they just worked a different application.
I have seen a few of these lesser breeds out here. I have yet to find anything lesser about them. Again, what they are bred for is much different then what the american breeds are bred for. I now have a pointer and it is so much more different than what I have owned in the past and I don't feel that I will be going with any other breed in the future. It just fits me now. This was a breed back in the day that I made fun of people for owning. Just wasn't a dog that I had respect for. We all change as we grow. What is best then may not float your boat now.
Just as with pointers and GSP's, we need people to have a love for these breeds to make them grow and develop. You need to have that kind of passion for anything to progress or get better. My hat is off to anyone who gives that kind of time to a breed to bring it along.
Joe
I think it was more of a mood thing. When I was in the mood to move and get at it, my GSP's were just go get em and cover tons of ground. It was always hit it and git it. When I had no where to be and just felt mellow or had one of my uncles or my dad with me or even my grandfather, my britt and especially my gordon was the dog to be behind. It was a great dog to thick cover. I am not saying my GSP's couldn't cover the ground they just worked a different application.
I have seen a few of these lesser breeds out here. I have yet to find anything lesser about them. Again, what they are bred for is much different then what the american breeds are bred for. I now have a pointer and it is so much more different than what I have owned in the past and I don't feel that I will be going with any other breed in the future. It just fits me now. This was a breed back in the day that I made fun of people for owning. Just wasn't a dog that I had respect for. We all change as we grow. What is best then may not float your boat now.
Just as with pointers and GSP's, we need people to have a love for these breeds to make them grow and develop. You need to have that kind of passion for anything to progress or get better. My hat is off to anyone who gives that kind of time to a breed to bring it along.
Joe
Re: Lesser Breeds
Geez, people buy what interests them whether it be a car, dog or pair of shoes. Many folks love to belive they have something is better than the othr guy has. It is human nature. I say, let em buy the dog they want and focus on my own. I really dont care who has what unless it is something I feel I want or need and I dont want or need anything these days cept a shoe box full of twenties.
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"If there are no dogs in Heaven,
then when I die I want to go
where they went."
Will Rogers, 1897-1935
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=5210
"If there are no dogs in Heaven,
then when I die I want to go
where they went."
Will Rogers, 1897-1935
Re: Lesser Breeds
That is EXACTLY why we have lesser breeds! :roll: Your good!markj wrote: Many folks love to belive they have something is better than the othr guy has.
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Dealer for Dogtra, Ruff Tuff and Mud River Need a product, just ask.
Re: Lesser Breeds
What would the American breeds be? Do you mean what we have made out of the Pointer? or crossbreeding to create the "American" GSP? or the Setter? or AA Wirehairs?what they are bred for is much different then what the american breeds
Forgive me...but I don't see a lot of difference when it comes to "American" bird dogs...they all want to be like Pointers...they all get to 50 lbs and turn white...you may as all call them "door knobs" for as different as they sometimes are.
To me, if you want to "be like Mike", just buy any of the white FT breeds...they're all trying to be like each other.
I apologize for being confrontational...but sounds to me everyone wants a white dog 500 yds in front of the horse.
Re: Lesser Breeds
You are aware I was defending the so called lesser breeds not knocking them.JKP wrote:What would the American breeds be? Do you mean what we have made out of the Pointer? or crossbreeding to create the "American" GSP? or the Setter? or AA Wirehairs?what they are bred for is much different then what the american breeds
Forgive me...but I don't see a lot of difference when it comes to "American" bird dogs...they all want to be like Pointers...they all get to 50 lbs and turn white...you may as all call them "door knobs" for as different as they sometimes are.
To me, if you want to "be like Mike", just buy any of the white FT breeds...they're all trying to be like each other.
I apologize for being confrontational...but sounds to me everyone wants a white dog 500 yds in front of the horse.
Joe
Re: Lesser Breeds
JKP wrote:I apologize for being confrontational...but sounds to me everyone wants a white dog 500 yds in front of the horse.what they are bred for is much different then what the american breeds
Nice to apoligize and it would be a gret time to stop since you are sorry. You can make a point without being a jerk.
Ezzy
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=144
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=207
It's not how many breaths you have taken but how many times it has been taken away!
Has anyone noticed common sense isn't very common anymore.
http://www.perfectpedigrees.com/4genview.php?id=207
It's not how many breaths you have taken but how many times it has been taken away!
Has anyone noticed common sense isn't very common anymore.
- Winchey
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Re: Lesser Breeds
"but sounds to me everyone wants a white dog 500 yds in front of the horse."
So what if they do? Are you telling these people that they like lesser breeds and they should want something else? Pretty hypocritical if you ask me.
So what if they do? Are you telling these people that they like lesser breeds and they should want something else? Pretty hypocritical if you ask me.
Re: Lesser Breeds
Ah, yet another venue snob. As I recall, you were considering taking a run at NAVHDA once your dog is too old and crippled up to do anything else. Good luck with that......ultracarry wrote:Being a part of NAVHDA don't you see more of the lesser dogs within the breed?