Public land hold over....

[Sylvan001]

Massachusetts stocks approximatley 44,000 pheasants every season. My question is. What is the percentage of {pen raised} birds that can actually stay alive throughout its first winter and actually reproduce the follwing spring?? Just curious. Thanks Gregg

[remmy]

We put out around that in Northern and Central NJ. Too many predators here. The state puts the birds out the night before and half are dead before the mornings hunt, all missing their heads. That's just one night. A lot of owls, hawks, fox around here. Besides that you can shoot roosters and hens, in most parts of the state. Considering the number of hunters, all birds left pretty much get shot. Very few make it through the season, if any.

[Sylvan001]

thanks, I think the same thing is happening up here in New England. A guy I met yesterday said pretty much exactly what you posted. Gregg

[KFhunter]

I don't know what they do with the hens, but all the birds they release are cocks in WA

haven't seen birds missing their heads, the whole carcass will be devoured and all you see is a pile of feathers, lots and lots of piles.
I think coyotes at night get them

[Greg Jennings]

Here, when the state does a "pheasant release", the parking lot looks like a Bengals game. RVs, tailgating, etc. The fields are gone over with a nit comb. There are a few birds left for the second day. By a couple of days later, there might be one out there somewhere...

I avoid these strenuously. It's not much like hunting.

Greg J.

[BigShooter]

Lots of studies & articles on the internet about pen raised birds, wild birds, survival rates & reproduction.

http://www.centralsusquehannapf.org/sur ... uction.pdf

http://www.npwrc.usgs.gov/resource/bird ... /manag.htm

http://www.pheasantsforever.org/page/1/population.jsp

To sum it up: if there isn't sufficient quality habitat to support any substantial wild pheasant population, stocking won't do a thing. Pen raised birds have higher mortality rates from predators than wild birds.

[tommyboy72]

Just out of curiousity what type of predator takes just the heads? I work at the sheriff's office here and one of our officers also a good friend of mine just finished his 2 year apprenticeship and licensing process to recieve his falconry license here in Oklahoma. He just trapped a red tail hawk to use as his hunting bird as well. Upon talking with him he was telling me that very rarely can an avian predator take a mature pheasant or quail. He said the Cooper's Hawk is the biggest problem for quail but pheasant are too wiley and fast for a large hawk to take. It is his dream to take a pheasant with his Red Tail Hawk but he does not suppose it will happen. He is going to concentrate mostly on rabbits right now. I always assumed that avian predators were the main scourge of quail and pheasant but he said that it is mostly ground based predators that take them. Coyotes, coons, skunks, etc.

[Greg Jennings]

Any nest raider is the bane of quail. Possums, racoons, snakes, etc. Some people have told me that turkey raid quail nests.

[Mountaineer]

I have released pheasants in Ohio that lived into the second summer....simply depends on many factors.
I have seen apparent carry-over birds in Pa.

Harriers take pheasant in Iowa...I expect other raptors also play a role.
%s of avain, nest raiders, foxes/coyotes all about split the predation with degree varying with the area of the country and the time of year...add in hunters for their part.
Re degree...Raptor migration down the spine of the Appalachians will find more harm to ruffed grouse than in other periods, for example.
Goshawks are the traditional northern grouse hawk but Coopers and Sharp-shinned can also be involved.
Raptor issues tho are rarely the most severe issue a gamebird faces but it is always one to bring out the pitchforks and firebrands.
However, there is no doubt the % is greater than in past years...saw many curved beaks in Kansas last year.

Owls have been known to de-head a bird.

[natetnc]

He said the Cooper's Hawk is the biggest problem for quail but pheasant are too wiley and fast for a large hawk to take.

remember we are talking about tame birds...... they are as lost as paris hilton in a grocery store. i have watched a redtail take a planted quail 30mins after release, they just don't have the survival skills.

[Sylvan001]

Will a mature rooster pheasant try and defend itself?? Or is it just an easy target all the time. Thanks for all the info. Gregg.

[BigShooter]

Like any other wild thing yes, they will try to defend themselves with their beak & the spurs on their legs. A wounded pheasant may try to use both against a dog trying to retrieve it. A dog may get a little bloodied up around the mouth but I've never seen one give up a retrieve. However a pheasant's ability to run 20 mph or more or fly are their best methods for escape. Their defenses are nearly useless against predators. The males use their leg spurs most often to spar or fight with other cocks. It's a pretty funny sight when you are quietly hunting a piece of CRP and all of a sudden you hear two cocks sounding off to one another and jumping a couple of feet up in the air as they spar.

[tn red]

Any nest raider is the bane of quail. Possums, racoons, snakes, etc. Some people have told me that turkey raid quail nests.

I sure believe this Greg

[KFhunter]

Like any other wild thing yes, they will try to defend themselves with their beak & the spurs on their legs. A wounded pheasant may try to use both against a dog trying to retrieve it. A dog may get a little bloodied up around the mouth but I've never seen one give up a retrieve. However a pheasant's ability to run 20 mph or more or fly are their best methods for escape. Their defenses are nearly useless against predators. The males use their leg spurs most often to spar or fight with other cocks. It's a pretty funny sight when you are quietly hunting a piece of CRP and all of a sudden you hear two cocks sounding off to one another and jumping a couple of feet up in the air as they spar.

I could see a dog getting tagged by a spur or two then getting pretty hard mouthed really quick, had one do this the other day, the cock was all puffed up and standing tall but the little britt has a tendency to use her paws like a cat, she batted it down with both paws then in her mouth in a split second.

[Mountaineer]

Any nest raider is the bane of quail. Possums, racoons, snakes, etc. Some people have told me that turkey raid quail nests.

I sure believe this Greg

I don't...more pitchforks and firebrands.

I can see that turkeys could scratch out the odd nest given the location but any significant factor in a gamebird decline, quail or ruffed grouse....nah.
The disease aspect tho needs investigated.

[solon]

Weasels like to eat just the heads. I have had a coon raid my pigeon coop and it ate some heads and also the breast meat. The brain is a fatty tissue, hence high energy, even a bird brain.

Solon

[fishvik]

My experience has been that if you have good habitat, primarily hiding cover, stocked roosters that survive the initial onslaught of hunters can hold on and holdover even with ground predators and definitely avian ones. I think the number one avian predator out here in the west is the raven. They are tough on nests and can take young birds before they can fly. The expansion of both their numbers and range has been shown to be responsibe for part of the decline on sage grouse out here.