Gun Dog Forum

Saddle

by Saddle » Tue Feb 05, 2013 4:57 pm Just want to get an idea of the trialers here and what venue do you compete in? It would appear that you are trying to garner specific information for subject matter credibility? If so wouldn't it be appropriate for you to provide that specific information about...

Saddle

Sure. We trial as much as we can. My fiancée runs a nice pointer bitch in some walking shooting dog stuff. I have a nice horseback shooting dog derby. I was hoping he would be an All Age dog but I don't think so. I went to my first trial when I was 17 years old that was 18 years ago. I have run all ...

Saddle

Just want to get an idea of the trialers here and what venue do you compete in?

Saddle

Man you guys don't have a sense of humor at all!

Ezzy its funny you should say that because you don't know me and couldnt pick me out if a crowd of one. Lighten up boys and girls. It was a joke. I'm gonna start another thread and leave this one alone. Its run its course.

Saddle

Neil I think field trial conversations should be just like championships you should have to have a win certificate to participate.

Saddle

Grange would you agree that you can't really push a dog from foot.

Saddle

I have a walking horse allin and he's fast and smooth and huge. Tarpin Hill is all you need!

Saddle

I like to go fast and enjoy the ride allin!

Saddle

You have to admit Neil that the grounds are pretty tight at Ames. That's why a lot of guys go and work out in that area a couple weeks before the big dance starts.

I agree though. The grounds are big enough to suit an all age competitor.

Saddle

Myers I get off the couch enough!

I will say this. I rode at 4 ch last year and only saw a couple dogs put down (in my opinion of what was) a true all age race. Most were shooting dogs.

Saddle

Good point ezzy.

Saddle

I'm glad you feel good corry. The concept of this collar was for better visibility a field trials if I'm not mistaken. My whole point was they are pretty particular about what you put on your dog at a trial and this may not go over.

Saddle

All this work on these collars you may not even be allowed to run them in field trials anyway.

Saddle

I'm not a big fan of making the pup thing a family affair. My pups are raised outside in a kennel. I socialize them a ton and fool with them everyday. I get my pups around birds and the horse at about 10 weeks. I'm different then most here though. My dogs aren't pets. I tend to think getting the fam...

Saddle

You're right on Neil. That's where the measure of a good one is in my opinion.

Saddle

Elk I fully agree but I think the sport of field trialing as a whole has gotten away from being about finding the best birddog. Sad but true. Heck you can win an all age ch with two well spaced finds in an hour. But if a guy wants to play the trial game he has to play within the guidelines as to wha...

Saddle

The key here is what is a persons definition of a nice dog.

Saddle

They can and do switch over from shooting dog to all age but rarely run both.

Saddle

This is almost uniquely an AKC thing. If a dog wins the shooting dog in an American field trial he probably won't be in the mix in the all age nor should he be.

Saddle

I doubt it. The dog is either a shooting dog or an all age dog. Good judges know the difference.

Saddle

IMO this is a result of poor judging and judges who don't the difference in a shooting dog and an all age dog. They are NOT the same thing.

Saddle

No I didn't. I put natural ability.

Retrieving and backing can be taught. The intangibles that make a great dog great cannot.

Saddle

Just because a dog is a good birddog doesn't mean he's worthy of being bred. Being a good hunting dog is only a small part of what goes into the overall evaluation of whether a dog should be bred or not. Other things I look at. Style. Class pointing and running. Nose. Trainability. Honesty. Natural ...

Saddle

Cajun Casey wrote:Buying a prospect that turns out means you have the talent to see past what's in your kennel already, so I'd say buying is the ultimate measure of ability to predict success.

It means you got really lucky. It is in no way at all is an evaluation of a trainers talent.

Saddle

For those that field trial breeding FC's is a lucrative business and I don't think there are to many pros that buy over breed. Buying a dog that doesn't work out becomes a complete waste of time. Breeding a dog that doesn't work out becomes a finished dog for sale with their kennel's name on it. In...

Saddle

Do you plan to breed your Roxy dog?

To answer the question I feel like you have a better chance of developing a legitimate champion dog if you breed a litter and keep all of them to evaluate. It would be more gratifying to do it that way in my opinion.

Saddle

It is but shouldn't be.

Saddle

I was just about to use you as an example John I'm glad you chimed in.

Saddle

What you read and what you see first hand are 2 different things.

Saddle

Answer my last question would you please. You seem to be avoiding it. In AFTCA trials you hardly see any continentals at the walking level. In Kansas alone you won't find any non pointer/setter dog of the year recipients. And it's not because there haven't been nice dogs run they just won't win You'...

Saddle

That's nice that you provided 1 example I can list dozens and dozens on the other end of that. I don't speak in absolutes. Ive watched hundreds and hundreds of dogs run. I've seen it happen a lot. Not every time but a lot of the time. You're really not trying to make the argument the Continental bre...

Saddle

I think I'm thinking of NSTRA events. They run trials for dogs with no placements. Wrong association sorry.

Shags thanks. I knew a restricted stake was for a certain breed. I guess I had my definition of limited fowled up.

Saddle

Ok. I don't know what I'm thinking about then.

Winchey I know I've seen stakes advertised as limited to dogs with no placements. It was a long time ago.

Saddle

The limited stakes I've seen the dogs had no placements is that right? I don't want to speak out of turn because I don't know.

Saddle

Do points in "limited" stakes count toward your championship in the AKC. If so that's a bigger problem than juvenile points counting.

Saddle

I would not take a pointer to a britt club trial even if it were open. You're going to get home cooked anyway. Most pointer guys have little interest or use for AKC events. There are a few pointers being run in AKC but most are run under American Field sanctioned events. I do think you could take a...

Saddle

I would not take a pointer to a britt club trial even if it were open. You're going to get home cooked anyway. Most pointer guys have little interest or use for AKC events. There are a few pointers being run in AKC but most are run under American Field sanctioned events. I do think you could take an...

Saddle

I don't know about the first week but not letting a pup be a pup is the biggest mistake I see.

Saddle

I misspoke Doug I should have said American field championships and not AFTCA.

Happy Jack won 3 derby championships in a month as a derby a couple years ago.

Saddle

heck in AFTCA trials you can be a champion without ever running in an adult stake.

Saddle

Gary Ansell sells a 209 primer insert for a single shot shotgun that works pretty slick.

Saddle

Some of it depends on the strain of quail. The guy I get mine from has developed a strain of birds that you can pack in together in a tight space and they won't kill each other. He can keep one per square foot if he needs to.

Saddle

Doug you're probably right. I guess I take it for granted that because I can simulate it that everyone can.

I do think you can prepare a pup or derby for a trial by doing the majority of the exposure stuff at home.

Saddle

Luisia02 wrote:
I agree with Karen. Puppy and Derby are very important for dogs to get the experience with horses, other handlers, other dogs, different grounds and to gain confidence.

I love it when people show up to field trials to "train" their dog. Do your exposure at home, not at a trial.

Saddle

I like the breed trials that will advertise four stakes along with the championship and close the championship to one breed but allow any breed in the companion stakes. I'll add this too. I hear this on this site and other sites about how britts and shorthairs and wirehairs and so on and so forth ca...

Saddle

I like to do the walking birds thing while I'm whoa breaking a dog. Keeps the dog focused and you can get a lot done as far as keeping him place when he's on a barrel. I do a lot of flushing with the dogs and walking birds around them during the whoa breaking process. It seems to make things for smo...

Saddle

How would a guy put a championship on these breeds if he had to compete against the big boys?

I agree. Closed breed trials are a joke.

Saddle

There is so much more that goes into an All Age dog then just the run. You can reproduce that run pretty easily and pretty regularly. It's all of the other things that go along with that run that are hard to get. Is he a good bird dog? Is he built right? Does he handle? Can he hang out on the front ...

Saddle

Neil just some more fyi. Horses are measured in 16.1, 16.2 or 16.3 and then go to 17 then 17.1. And so on. There is no 16.5. Good try again though. I have a 4 year old walking horse gelding that is 16.3 right now. He'll finish over 17. Go look at some of Luke Eisenharts horses and tell me they're sm...

Saddle

It's pretty narrow minded to think everyone should like the same kind of dog you do.

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